I am wondering what people consider to be a rolling mount on a 36" unicycle.
The reason I ask is this video I made (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k88MdY4_XIA), where I call the mount a “Rolling mount”. Because the wheel stops during the mount, I am told that this is not a Rolling mount. Some even calls it a “Static mount”, which i think is very different.
I’ve watched som videos, and it looks like MuniAddict for intstance almost (it is difficult to see) manage to keep the wheel rolling. It seems to me that this is basically the same mount as the one in my video.
You also have the giraffe rolling mount(there are several videos of this). There is no way you can keep the wheel rolling forward during the whole mount on a giraffe.
I’d like to hear what you think, and I would also like to se some videos of a true rolling mount on a 36" uni. Thanks.
With or without the run this looks like a jump mount. I can see why people would say it’s a static mount, but I don’t think so. In my view a static mount doesn’t take advantage of the riders inertia to get the weight ahead of the wheel to start the wheel moving. When I static mount my 20 it stays put in a still stand for a moment before i start pedaling, or hopping.
In a rolling mount both feet hit the pedals at about the same time, and the wheel doesn’t stop, or hesitate, as the rider lands on the pedals and begins pedaling.
I see the way you mount in your video as what is known as a rolling mount. In the other thread I mentioned that it just seemed to me that it ended up in some kind of static mount, because the wheel stops when you get on. Of course the difference is that your body has some momentum, which should make it easier to get on top of the monster.
A real rolling mount to me would be where the wheel keeps rolling, just like when you want to hop on a b#ke while pushing it forward. I reckon if you’re really good, unlike me, you can do just that on a uni as well, maybe by landing on the saddle first and in that moment finding the pedals with your feet (not your hands )
As I wrote on FB the crucial difference for me is that with a rolling mount you keep the wheel rolling until after you put the first foot on, so that you benefit from the momentum of the uni lifting that foot up and allowing you to put more weight on that foot than you can with a static mount. If you stop the wheel after that point due to using up the momentum of the uni then it’s still a rolling mount if not quite as pure - hence the giraffe rolling mounts where you end up with some rollback are still rolling mounts. I checked out my old videos of when I first learnt the rolling mount and I even have a little roll back on a learner 20", but that’s after I’ve got on - the wheel is still rolling forwards when I put the first foot on. With your mount, there’s a very clear point where you’ve stopped the uni before your first foot hits the pedal, which to me makes it not a rolling mount because there is no roll.
I’m kind of wishing I hadn’t commented though, because it’s an effective mount which clearly works for you and it doesn’t really matter what you call it. IMHO keeping the uni rolling makes the mount easier as you can weight the back foot, but that’s just me. As I also mentioned, a lot of people would say my “static mount” isn’t a static mount because I also make use of a little bit of wheel roll to give me a bit of extra momentum, though without taking any steps, and I think I stop the wheel before the jump.
This is an example of what I think of as a rolling mount (not mine, my early videos are rubbish and I didn’t used to keep the wheel rolling after I put the first foot on - I do now keep the wheel rolling, but I can’t do a new one as I’m off the uni after an op, hence spending too much time on the internet):
Interesting - I described it as a combination of static/jump, because for me a jump mount has both feet hitting the pedals at the same time. Though it’s actually a rolling/static/jump combo, with elements of all 3.
Hmm I’m not sure about both feet hitting at the same time - I’d say that is a jump mount and for a rolling you definitely don’t, as I describe above.
I wouldn’t really call that a true rolling mount but who cares, it worked just fine to get going. That’s probably pretty similar to what it looks like when I free mount my 36er.
I think technically it’s not a rolling mount because in a rolling mount the wheel doesn’t stop when you jump on. In this case you are using the momentum of running to lift yourself up on the wheel. With a true rolling mount the momentum from running stays in the wheel so you don’t have to pedal hard at the beginning. So with your way you have to pedal harder once you are up but with a true rolling mount you have to jump harder to get up.
As you say yourself, “the wheel stops before you jump”
The walk forward gives you some forward momentum from which you can launch onto the unicycle. So the mount is not totally static because the rider is always moving throughout the mount.
The video is very well made.
I, personally prefer my left pedal a bit lower as I mount i.e. four o’ clock position but I’m doing a rolling mount so the pedal is moving upward as I mount. I hold the front of the saddle with my left hand.
Thank’s everybody for constructive feedback. I am now convinced that my tutorial mount is NOT a TRUE Rolling mount. :o After reading Unibokk’s post it dawned on me, and I went outside to try it in the dark. I think I got it a couple of times and it was a great feeling to be lifted up and sent off to a (almost) flying start. This is the mount to use if you need to make a quick getaway. I’ll practice some more when it’s light. aracer said the same thing as Unibokk earlier on Facebook, but I didn’t get it then - probably because he is on a 29’er. What I think now, is that my tutorial mount is a perfect mix between a Static mount and a Rolling mount.
So which of the two mounts is the best? My initial thought is that the true rolling mount requires better timing to hit the first pedal. It also takes more guts as you have to launch yourself over then uni with speed and determination with the risk of a face plant.
I’d say the not-so-true rolling mount is better for a beginner because it is easier to hit the first pedal, and you have more time to get your body over the center of gravity.
As a matter of general interest, I looked up the list of skills on Leo’s page (as a level 10 rider, he would be a good one to go to), and looked at his demonstration of the rolling mount. If you watch very closely, it looks like even this has a milisecond delay in the cranks’ circular motion between the first and second foot landing. Maybe I’m wrong.
302a, Rolling Mount:
Mounting the uni while pushing the uni forward, by placing one foot on the rear pedal and going up and over the wheel, without the wheel pausing, stopping or going backwards and continue riding forward.
That’s the strict definition (Standard Skill is, if anything, strict!). What we lack is a good name for the “in spirit” rolling mount. To me, Walking mount doesn’t work, especially for 36" or larger wheels, because it’s not about the speed, it’s about the momentum.
While it’s not hard to learn the strict rolling mount, especially on a smaller wheel, it’s less practical than the similar mount where the wheel stops to let you catch up to it. Especially on larger wheels. While the wheel doesn’t have a continuous roll, the rider’s forward motion is uninterrupted. Leo’s clip is a perfect example of that, and I still think of that as a rolling mount, just not a strict one.
I suppose we should all start suggesting names for the rolling mount that pauses. I’ll start:
In Motion Mount
Rolling Static Mount (yes, an oxymoron)
A so-called rolling mount on a giraffe is even less rolley. You generally have to pull the top pedal back to get the wheel up under you (at least on a 6-footer). I prefer the term Catapult Mount.
I’m glad you haven’t taken my comments the wrong way, though I should have thrown in more positive stuff as I agree it’s a great video (I’d probably not have commented on a bad one!) I agree with you that your way is probably easier to learn - I have a static mount nailed 99+%, but my rolling mount is still a long way from that and your way is possibly easier than what I’m doing. Though I’m going to keep going the way I am as it feels a lot more positive using the momentum of the wheel to lift me on. As unibokk says, I also hit the pedal a bit lower down than you do.
I had another go at the Rolling mount today in the daylight, and I think I got it a couple of times. I noticed two things. First: It is faster - I don’t have very good time to focus on the pedals. That part is more instinctive. Second: I am leaning more forward just before I hit the first pedal. As a result, the handlebar obstructs my view a little bit.
I like this mount, it is more fun to do than the other one.
During a rolling mount, the wheel will stop rotating momentarily during the mount, no matter how fast to run. This is simply because you cannot start pedaling until your second foot reaches the forward pedal, and your weight gets just past center of gravity. The momentum of the rotating wheel is transferred to the frame at the moment you jump onto the uni, as the frame swings upward on its bearings while the pedals and wheel remain pretty much stationary for that brief moment.
Same thing when you do a rolling hop; just as you ride to the top edge of a stair set, the wheel stops quickly as you jump with the pedals horizontal, and they remain that way until the landing. When I do a rolling mount, my right foot first hits the back-facing pedal, followed by my left foot, and that is the foot that starts the downstroke, but not until you are in a slight forward lean, after the frame has completed its upward swing. If you try to start pedaling before you hit your COG, you will likely fall backwards, off the uni.
I don’t believe that’s true - if you have enough of a roll then you can keep the wheel rolling (slowly) right through the frame coming up and your weight getting in front of the centre of gravity, provided you don’t put too much weight on the back pedal. That’s if you’re talking about the wheel rolling relative to the road - sure there’s a point where the wheel remains stationary relative to the frame as the whole thing rotates forwards as one, but that’s not the same thing.
Checking out Jan-Erik’s new video, I certainly can’t see any point the wheel stops, not even in the super slo-mo from 10s on.
It may not totally stop to the point to absolute zero movement, but for that very short moment you are jumping up and you first foot hits the back facing pedal, the wheel has effectively stopped rolling forward to such a degree that for all intents and purposes, it has stopped, or at least slowed down significantly, until the rider is just past COG. Again, that’s where all the forward rolling momentum is momentarily transferred to the frame swinging upward.
MuniAddict and aracer: It’s definitely possible to keep the wheel rolling. I didn’t think so myself, but after reading Unibokk and aracer’s posts, I could do it almost right away (not on every attempt, but some). The key factor is to hit the first pedal as soon (quick) as possible after it has passed 6 o’clock, and lean your upper body forward. Don’t focus on the rolling of the wheel. If done right the wheel will keep rolling. I bet that a better rider (like MuniAddict) could make the wheel spin pretty quick during the whole mount. Waiting for a video
I’m doing this on a trails uni, so there is a lot less momentum at play, but when I rolling mount, I put my foot on the pedal when it is about 30 degrees forward of vertical, as though in the middle of a down stroke. If I do it right, the wheel never stops moving, nor do I. While could be doable on a 36, it could be hard to reach the pedal when it is that far forwards.
I came across a thread from 2004, which was a fun read for me, because it was pretty much the same discussion as this one. John Foss suggested then that the standard skill definition of the rolling mount should be modified, so that it would still be a rolling mount even if the wheel stopped during the mount.
They were also looking for a name for this mount back then. The suggestions where: Moving Mount, Modified Rolling Mount, Momentum Mount, Moving Static Mount
Personally I like Moving Mount. I don’t think the name should have the word “Static” in it.
On a bigger uni you don’t have to reach the pedal that far forwards, because the pedals are travelling slower and there is more momentum in the wheel. I rolling mount my 19 and my 29 and hit the pedal earlier on the 19.
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the crucial difference for me is that with a rolling mount you keep the wheel rolling until after you put the first foot on, so that you benefit from the momentum of the uni lifting that foot up and allowing you to put more weight on that foot than you can with a static mount. If you stop the wheel after that point due to using up the momentum of the uni then it’s still a rolling mount if not quite as pure - hence the giraffe rolling mounts where you end up with some rollback are still rolling mounts. I checked out my old videos of when I first learnt the rolling mount and I even have a little roll back on a learner 20", but that’s after I’ve got on - the wheel is still rolling forwards when I put the first foot on. With your mount, there’s a very clear point where you’ve stopped the uni before your first foot hits the pedal, which to me makes it not a rolling mount because there is no roll.
This is the mount to use if you need to make a quick getaway. I’ll practice some more when it’s light. aracer said the same thing as Unibokk earlier on Facebook, but I didn’t get it then - probably because he is on a 29’er. What I think now, is that my tutorial mount is a perfect mix between a Static mount and a Rolling mount.