I’d like to thank you for sharing what you’ve created so far Ioan. I’d also like to apologize for how some people have treated you here. You have to remember that a good few of the people here are still young and maturing.
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Dakoroman: Thank you, Brian O., you don’t need to apologise for anyone else’s kind of thinking or behaviour.
I have great confidence and hope that the young generations are not lesser than any others and the future is secured.
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MAESTRO8 wrote:
There is but one way to answer many of these questions without much pontification, supposition, hand waving and mouth flapping.
The cranks must be built and ridden.
I don’t think it will be an easy task… but Ioan has dropped the gauntlet.
Hey Ioan, have you any engineering drawings of your cranks, or have you already shown us all you’ve got? If so, well… I’m stymied at step one. I haven’t any CAD software.
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Dakoroman : Maestro8, I didn’t drop any gauntlet, always, all the time, I say what I want to say, the way I consider to be said, to reach maxim impact, in those circumstances.
The main concept of DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEM NUMERO UNO, is to concentrate the weight and stresses of the rider and HPV in a point where it can be be better managed, also reducing manufacturing prices, easyness to operate, etc.
I have started with a question: why were they using such big wheel for Penny Farting/ Bone Breaker, instead of smaller one and fast? My own answer was because they didn’t have the correct type of drive system/ pushing direct with the legs can only take you to the next stage = unicycles.
Any kind of frame had to support huge stresses, so what if I put everything to act mainly in the centre of the wheel/ hub, etc.
My solution to this problem is DAKOROMAN GEARED CRANKS/ everyone understands that we need a point to support the forces/ moments/ torques, so other than frames for example, what about if we use our own body?
The rest is history, step by step I have encounter other problems which required other solutions, the more/ deeper/ more profound I advanced, the more I could develop it, ending up with many solutions= applications.
There is not a single, Universal solution, so you have to balance between different “targets” you want to achieve and side effects.
Maestro8, what exactly you can not understand, the main concept is very simple, you need more than explanations, you want me to post the official drawings.
Weeks and weeks I begged on the Forum to talk to somebody, sending those drawings, to discuss, to say that I was totally ignored is a very polite uderstatement.
A single gentlemen, from Portsmouth, England, an engineer, has signed the NDA and I sent him the same sketches posted on this Forum.
My hope to manufacture, becoming partners, etc, didn’t eventuate/ that was the reason why I was late a few weeks fulfilling my PROMISE, to post them.
So, I decided to release the main concept and some applications on Unicyclist Forum and you have to understand: THAT IS ALL I CAN DISCLOSE AT THIS MOMENT/ you will notice some gaps in sketches.
There is a reason for that, also the total number of drawings/ sketches/ applications is much bigger than 81; I like to share my creations, but within some limits, I spend time to generate them and one day I will post the rest, which even just a little bit are connected with other plans/ designs, please, understand.
I have DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEM NUMERO DUE and DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEM NUMERO 3, I am still working at new applications.
What is the point to talk about them now, or to send profesisonal/ engineering drawings? Just to receive answers like " LOL", or another one " I would like to meet the man in real life…just to see why he is so weird" / check the previous dakoroman posts/ comments.
Not a single reason prooving that I am weird, no, I have to deal with an imbecile sentence, I have to prove that I am not weird.
CAD, a beautiful program, but for me, a crayon/ ball-pen, rule, Kompass, eraser, A4 paper, are all I need, there are not limits.
I am an addict/ junkie: not a chemicaly induces high, a mental one, the flush of inspiration/ satisfaction when I find a good solution/ design are net superior to any other high/ “A-HA- HA, LOL”.
Maestro8, I am afraid our journey together will end soon, you are a “mad scientist”/ that is a compliment, the only way for you and others to know the real value of DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEMs 1,2,3 is one of the Forum Masters/ engineers, manufacturers, designers,etc, to get involved.
Enough for now, Ioan DAKOROMAN, Sydney
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Dakoroman: Brian O., I believe that you should seriously consider DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEMS for PROJECT UNI!
Ioan “Dakoroman” OASA, Sydney.
You say that you have been disrespected etc dakoroman, but do you not think you gave people reason to have these views when you were so closed about your ideas and none of your posts actually had/have a clear point to make?
I think people were just a bit overwhelmed with your hyperactivity, and lack of substance as proof of what you were trying to say. Now there is some substance that is not the case, however the reason to capitalise certain words in your sentences still eludes me.
Wow, Dakoroman! My respect for you has increased about tenfold! I think it’s a very neat engineering solution, flipping the problem around and putting gears in the cranks! Lateral thinking! Let’s hope you can find a way to manufacture those cranks and put them to test. But even if they don’t work, it’s still rather clever, I think. And hopefully there’s still gonna be a way to make them work.
I wish you all the best and please keep us posted.
Well, I’m another who is very surprised there is any actual idea at all behind this. You really didn’t put yourself across very well at all mate!
The geared cranks are certainly very different and interesting. I’m skeptical that they could be made strong enough without being ridiculously heavy, and I reckon the torque at the pedal (what you call “Dakoroman torque”) would be too big even with longer pedals (certainly if it was geared up usefully), but it would be interesting to try it and find out in practice. You’re effectively using the rider’s ankle as the torque arm of the gear system, right, even if the pedal was firmly attached to the shoe?
Also, the pedals would move in a freaky way round the circle unless the rider kept their feet at the same angle for the whole revolution (which they don’t) - a bit like PowerCranks as somebody else mentioned. That may make unicycling feel pretty bizarre, but might not be a problem.
Very interesting, though I don’t think you’re going to become rich from it.
Rob
I was hoping not to read pages and pages of stuff to find an answer to my simple question. I think it would have taken you less time to answer me than it did to chide me.
I was just trying to shorten your name. People call people by abbreviated handles all the time on this forum. I confess, in my head I’ve been reading your handle as “Dankorman” for some reason. I should have called you “Dak,” my bad. Shortening handles is part of the internet, though, get used to it. I meant no offense.
If it weren’t for us asking you questions this thread would be down on page three by now. The second we all go silent your ideas will stop being read.
I have understood your concept and have done a few sketches myself… hoping to calculate the torques and stresses applied at various points in your design.
I was asking for more detailed drawings including dimensions, etc. so as to determine which machines / parts would be needed to realize the design, what materials you’ve selected for the design, and how heavy the final product might be.
I’m not ready to run off to production with this, but this sounds like a fun project for the hobby machinist… and I know just the machinist 
So you’re just like the hoardes of kids on Yahoo! Answers who put their homework questions online so they don’t have to do any of the work? Why do you expect anyone to come around and do you homework for you? …and of all people, Professor Oasa?
Speak for yourself. Some of us here engage our brains on such topics for the sheer joy of it. With so much food for thought in less than 20 pages, Ioan has given some of us a veritable treasure trove of project ideas.
From what I gather (without having studied the documents very closely), there are no working models? Really, it’s all kind of theory until someone tries it. Then you start getting to where you can prove some of the original assertions may have some truth to them.
For 130 years or so, the cycling world has been filled with inventors with “revolutionary” ideas that will totally change the way we think about human powered transport. I remember going to the big bicycling trade show in NYC in 1985 (forget the event’s name; they no longer do it there). I saw tons of “great new ideas” but most are already long gone. A few I remember:
- Most notably the Semcycle’s introduction (which was why I was there). Though the brand name is still around, the original Semcycle seems to be out of production. And their “revolutionary” idea of using radial spokes on a powered wheel was very short-lived…
- There was a bike rack that was designed to attach to a car’s trailer hitch. This was the first I’d seen of that idea, and I bought one. It was primitive but it worked; much better designs are available now.
- Sheepskin seat covers for comfort. Nothing new there, but the vendors had one made to fit a Schwinn unicycle seat, which they sold to me. I imagine it was the only one they made, so it still resides proudly on my big wheel (45"), even though it’s seen better days.
- How about those bike seats that are two separate parts, a left and a right, that hinge to move with your butt cheeks? They’re still around too, and nobody uses them except people who don’t ride enough to get used to regular bike seats or people with medical problems.
My point being, major revolutions in this stuff are hard to come by. Even when working models have been built; even brought to market, such as the Uniq-o, most turn out to be interesting curiosities, but nothing more.
The Dakoroman Drive System(s) (pardon me for not using all caps) seem to be a very clever way of introducing the gearing system into the crank arms, so the idea can be applied to all sorts of vehicles. As long as you don’t care about rotating mass, which looks like a lot, and also assuming the system will pedal well, without making your ankles tired out really quick.
Yahoo huh? Low blow. I read the pdf, it wasn’t very clear to me, so I asked a clarifying question. He responded by basically saying “Isn’t it obvious? Read it again!” I think that’s awful rude. I wonder if he has a rubric I could look at so I can tell which questions are allowed and which ones are too rudimentary for him to deal with. Isn’t discussion the whole point of this thread? Discussion is not us asking a clarifying question and then him chiding us for asking something that he apparently thinks is obvious.
You misunderstood me. Why would I be in this thread is I wasn’t engaging in the topic for the sheer joy of it? However, what I mentioned was a FACT. If we didn’t post in this thread it would disappear to page 2 or 3 where no one would see it. He is actively discouraging any discussion that he sees as “below him.” Threads don’t last long like that.
Anyways, sorry about the derailment. You and I can disagree and leave it at that. Hopefully Dakoroman will begin to embrace questions and his ideas, which are good, will be accepted. Obviously he doesn’t want my input, so I’ll leave it to you folks. Good luck.
You could build a pair of those cranks on a wheel quite easily out of normal technical Lego. I’d do it now, but my Lego is all at my parents’ place 120 miles away. It wouldn’t be ideal, and certainly wouldn’t be very strong, but it ought to be enough to get a general idea of how much torque would need to applied with the ankle (or hands in the case of the model) while pedaling. From memory, I think the biggest Lego wheel was about 4 or 5 inches diameter in my day, so unless there are bigger ones now you may have to improvise a bit to stop the cranks hitting the ground (like “riding” it along a skinny beam or something).
If nobody’s done it by the time I’m next around my Lego I’ll build one, but there must be somebody who could try it sooner.
If the ankle torque does turn out to be too big to use without attaching the shoe to the pedal and/or using ankle braces, wouldn’t hanging the pedal platform a bit below the pedal axle, a bit like a BC plate, help? (in my head it seems like that would give you a longer lever, and some of the twisting would be resisted by the normal downward pressure on the pedal).
I still think a full-size pair of Dakoroman cranks would end up either very heavy or too weak though. But that’s just my opinion/guess, not based on any real calculations.
Rob
OK, who’s building the first pair?
Ioan-
Thanks for finally posting some diagrams and descriptions. Let me tell you what I think about the geared cranks type A.
The relative density of aluminum is about 3 and the relative density of steel is about 8. The radii of the two gears shown in your figure 17b for a ratio of 2:1 are 5.4cm and 2.7cm. Let’s be liberal and say that you can get away with 1cm of gear tooth contact which is about 40% of what I use and 33% of what Florian uses. Steel gears with that little contact area on a unicycle crank/axle interface with the torques required will probably shear but let’s say they don’t. Lets also say that the bearings you are going to use are massless and that 0.5cm thick aluminum plate is stout enough to use on both sides of your geared cranks.
Your crank systems will weigh about the area times the thickness of the two gears times the density of steel plus the area times the thickness of your plates times the density of aluminum. Let’s say the plates are about twice the area of the gears because you have to have room to put in pins and they are comprised of two circles plus some other additional area for the structure. I estimate that one of these cranks will weigh 1.26kg. It will have an effective length of the sum of the radii or 81mm. The center of mass of the crank along the axis drawn from the wheel axle to the pedal axle will not be in the center between these two axles but will be 80% of the way out toward the pedal.
These are some heavy cranks that are extremely short and extremely unbalanced. Think about spinning a unicycle wheel with normal cranks and pedals and holding it by the saddle in front of you. It wobbles a lot. Now put two of these unbalanced behemoths on and think what will happen. Then think about how much wobble that will introduce while riding. Also, these will be put on a reasonably sized wheel. On a 29" wheel the effective wheel diameter will be 58" or 147cm. Someone will be trying to ride a 58" wheel with 81mm cranks that are heavy and greatly unbalanced.
If you want to increase the effective crank length you’re going to need bigger gears and more weight. The weight of the system will go up as the square of one of the gear diameters so to double the crank length you have to quadruple the weight. Some 162mm cranks would weigh 4kg each or about 9 pounds each. And they would still be unbalanced. Some of this weight would have to be removed by selectively removing material from the gears and support plates.
In addition to these problems, I don’t see how the two cranks are linked in your figure. It appears as if allowed to the two cranks would both rotate to the position where the pedals were both at the bottom if you lifted any weight off the pedals. As the cranks dropped to vertical, the pedals would rotate from their horizontal positions to about 45 degrees from horizontal. Perhaps I have missed something. This would make it impossible to ever lift one leg from this unicycle. If you did, when the weight left the pedal it would rotate about the gear train and the cranks invariably would end up no longer parallel. The pedals would be slightly rotated from horizontal.
In principle I think these cranks would work. In practice I think they would be next to impossible if not impossible to use on a unicycle. On other cycles they may work better but unless I’m mistaken weight still has to be applied to both pedals at all times.
Dakoroman Drive Systems Pdfx1
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DAKOROMAN: I want to thank to all who see the whole thing in a positive/ hopeful way, the best wishes for you.
Let’s be clear: we are posting on Unicyclist Forum because we love these mechanisms/ concepts/ ideas; of course, we are not the same, but individuals bringing personalised experience, knowledge, egos, imagination, jokes/ more or less new.
From time to time, some “sparkling moments” erupt, arguments amplified, pay-backs, I said that/ you said that, implying that…
We only debate ideas; apart of those who met each other/ competitions/ conferences/ exhibitions/ picturese/ video clips, etc, we are complete strangers with a common denominator, HPV’s/ Unicycles.
Trying to prove “a point” is a fine balance line between not enough and overstepping the margin, it is so easy to make mistakes/ I made plenty.
But we are also thinking humans, so the best in such situations is to shake hands/ apologise and should be the end of the matter.
I am convinced that not a single Unicyclist member hates me/ doesn’t like me, the reverse is valid as well, what is the point?
Some of us have “special” ways to express our thoughts, but trying to change/ how the others should think is a futile exercise.
Let’s be friends, “fighting” for our perspectives, but within some limits.
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I have created DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEM to be an answer to portability/ transportability/ sustainable HPV’s, etc.
It was nevwer intended to be the perfect solution for each HPV’s type.
However, I strongly believe that some applications can really benefit of this concept/ novelties, especially HPV’s with smaller wheels, folding, compact.
The main concept/ and others (please study them also) are now in Public Domain and everyone can see them, improve, manufacture, redesign, etc.
Maestro8: "I’m not ready to run off to production with this, but this sounds like a fun project for the hobby machinist… and I know just the machinist "…
Dakoroman: Maestro8, please allow me to guess who is the hobby machinist/ that’s how I make my living, guessing and never missing.
I have three atempts, just say YES or NO; 1- Mr. Florian SCHLUMPF, 2- Mr. Florian Schlumpf, and the winner 3- Mr. Florian Schlumpf/ I told you so.
My favourite one/ design is the one from figures 19 and 20, that is DAKOROMAN ULTIMAX, similar figure 10/ no frame + GOD’s HAND/ which comes from Maradona, Diego Armando/ my first love is football.
Designed for small wheels, leisure type products/ easy to operate/ ride, just two gears, no DAKOROMAN LONG PLATE, not a big problem for ankles.
I think you sub/ under/estimate the strength of human ankles; a few weeks ago I have seen a few healthy ladies in Sydney/ Rugby League fans with legs like 400 years old trees, so the interreaction between DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEMS and their ankles would break/ smash the whole joint, C’mon!
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“Gild: OK, who’s building the first pair?”
DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEM and APPLICATIONS belong to all of us/ yes, I still have MORAL RIGHTS, I am the original creator, but everyone is invited to have any kind of input/ you too, SEAGER= mate, or 15"/ as in inches teenagers.
I noticed in Unicyclist Forum/and other forums many members “involved” in IT.
What is the story here, IT/ HPV’s? an afrodisiac ?
Ioan “Dakoroman” OASA, Sydney
I doubt that’s who he meant. Mr Schlumpf could hardly be called a “hobby machinist” - I think it’s a bit more than that to him!
My guess is Greg Harper, who posted above your last post. He’s certainly capable of making something like this and has access to the required facilities (he built a few epicyclic hubs before Schlumpf started producing them, if you didn’t know).
Rob
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Dakoroman: It was a joke/ I could write any other name, to enhance the way we can guess without missing.
Mr. Greg HARPER is much more than a hobby machinist either.
I know all his creations from his own web page, no doubts about his high quality crafstmanship; if he wants to make anything, the Unicycling community/ and others will benefit.
It is no longer about me, my mission was to inject you with some DAKOROMAN CONCEPTS, the rest is following the Horizon line.
By the way, is any any of you Primary School teacher?
Just give your pupils DAKOROMAN DRIVE SYSTEM as homework; their parents will execute everything in record times and will have a hand on the Sankt Books, telling with a straight face that their children have done it.
Any form of expression is good/ enhancing our spirit.
Ioan “Dakoroman” OASA, Sydney.
Yoikes!
I was a bit more conservative with my napkin-and-crayon calculations. I was shooting for a more modest 1.5 : 1 gear ratio… but I failed to consider tooth contact, and didn’t even bother to see if anything would shear. They never taught us these things in our Physics classes!
Nonetheless, I’ve yet to find a good compromise between weight and crank length. This was the crux for me… I wasn’t comfortable with anything less than 100mm, but the 10+ lbs of weight seemed prohibitive.
Being that I didn’t have spare gears lying around, I did a little shopping and found that I’d have to shell out at least $80 just to make these clunkers. What a rip!
Ioan, did you even bother to do any of these calculations? Do you really think adding 20 lbs to a riding machine would make it any more useful?
Geez.
Anyways, I doubt I’m going to rush off to the shop to crank out a pair of these things.
Ioan-
Now that you have posted actual sketches for these devices this discussion becomes unicycle related and should be moved out of Just Conversation. You may want to consider posting your .pdf files in a thread started in RSU. There are those who avoid the incessant nonsensical chatter in Just Conversation and only read in RSU. Those folks may be able to provide other useful comments on your design.
Godby moves in mysterious ways.