But is it even really a problem on a fixed wheel with new hubs? Or is it a known issue on new hubs due to the disk now being attached to the (formerly often greasy) shell?
On freewheel geared hubs, I think we need affordable single speed freewheel hubs first to actually increase the number of people riding freewheel, which might create space in the market for such a thing.
I suspect that the expense of COVID madness will make it unlikely for anyone to pick up the torch from bicymple and get some more of those lovely budget ISIS hubs made, but that’s what I’d like to see happen next.
I probably also need to sell a few of my freewheel bits
It is an issue with new hubs, yes. It has been discussed on this forum a few times. As far as I know, Roger has started to design a part to prevent the grease from going onto the rotor.
Does “single speed freewheel hubs” mean “hubs with a single gear ratio greater than 1”? If so, I’m not sure this would work out. As I understand freewheel unicycling nowadays, most of the riders ride muni. They definitely need a 1:1 gear ratio for such riding. I’m not sure having single geared freewheel hubs would change that fact and lure people into riding freewheel on the road. IMHO, we really need geared hubs with multiple gear ratios for people to start riding freewheel on the road.
BTW… As someone already unipacked on a freewheel? Not that I’m planning to do so in a few weeks, but that may be the case…
No, I just mean basic 1:1 hubs. These days your options are square taper drift trike hubs that are still quite hard to get, Qu-Ax Pipifax, or Mad4One Flick Flock.
There’s no good option for beginners to get into freewheel, especially those without technical expertise or a large amount of disposable income.
I’m very interested to hear how that turns out. I’ve often wondered how a freewheel would react, especially while the uni is loaded down with panniers. Sounds scary, IMO as I figure the uni would be much harder to maneuver.
I’ll let you know! I’ll try to ride as light as possible. I don’t think my uni will weigh more than 13 kg with all the stuff on it (an amazingly light tent, a sleeping bag, some clothes). Of course, I will also bear a few things in my backpack (water, food, rain clothes, tools), but it shouldn’t weigh too much either.
The plan is to ride 410 km in 6 days, so a bit less than 70 km per day. I will mostly follow EuroVelo roads (6 & 15) which should be smooth and flat.
I still have a few adjustments to make, but here’s what my uni should look like:
I’m reacting a little late, but it’s funny I thought the same thing about “funi” a few weeks ago. I’m not a big fan of creating new words. I already have trouble using the term “muni”, you can ride a unicycle in the mountains without off-roading, and vice versa.
On the other hand, I think the link between “funi” and “funny” makes sense. A freewheel unicycle is essentially fun.
As for @Maxence 's desire for a freewheeling unicycle with speed. I don’t think that’s the way to develop freewheeling.
A larger series of Pipifax hubs at a slightly lower price seems to me a better solution.
On the other hand, there’s one aspect I didn’t see coming before I started coasting a lot. A higher ratio can give you better control over forward balance. When coasting at 20-25 km/h, on most unicycles, it’s too fast to catch up by pedaling. This can be easier with a large wheel and small cranks. This is where a higher ratio could be interesting. On my setup with a 29” wheel and 110 mm cranks, when coasting at this speed, I can’t make up for a forward imbalance by pedaling forward. But with a Schlumpf, I can.
Maxence, what makes you think that the Schlumpf’s freewheel is bad?
The “muni” word essentially comes from “mountain bike”, which directly means the discipline of riding the trails in mountains. So, as strange it can be for non-native English speakers such as we are, it makes total sense for native English speakers
I have noticed the same thing. These last months, I have ridden my 36er with 110mm and 136mm cranks. I have found it much easier to avoid crashing with small cranks. I’m now planning to go even smaller (85mm ) and observe how easy or hard it is.
The worse point is the oil that leaks from the hub and contaminates the rotor and pads. The more you ride, the less brake power you have. That’s a major issue on a freewheel.
Besides, I don’t know the details of the freewheel Schlumpf hub, but I guess it is not a sprag clutch. So, no instant engagement. The question becomes: how many points of engagement does the hub have? As far as I know, this is no public information.
To conclude on this point: as per our discussions, it seems to me that we don’t have the same point of view on freewheels. I have understood that you consider the ability to freewheel as a toy. You don’t seem to find it practical in any way. I, personally, think freewheeling is useful for mountain riding - whether it is on-road or off-road. In my opinion, having multiple gears would let us ride on more trails and gradients, as we wouldn’t have to choose between torque and speed. We would have both, as fixed riders have.
This difference in our points of view may be due to the fact that I live nearer to the mountains that you do. It’s basically my daily or weekly routine to go into the mountains. So, I envisage my practice in these mountains, where I miss either torque or speed. On flat roads or in gyms, it’s much easier to envisage a single-speed freewheel uni as you can chose a single gearing that suits you.
I’m not saying you’re wrong: we definitely need sprag clutch hubs at a lower price to develop freewheeling. This would help people to start on a great hub, before transitioning to a multi-speed hub. In short, as people do for fixed riding
If @rogeratunicycledotcom has the time, it would be great to hear how realistic such a thing would be from someone with that manufacturing experience. I imagine it would be a pretty large moderately risky investment to get such hubs down to a reasonable price, if indeed it would be possible to get sprag clutch hubs much cheaper.
I still think more riders freewheeling on cheaper hubs would be more beneficial to freewheeling as a whole than cheaper high quality hubs.
All unicycles are toys (and not only), but it’s true that freewheeling is particularly fun.
If I understand correctly, you consider that there are uses where a freewheel unicycle would be more efficient than a fixed wheel. I can’t imagine that. And yet, I have an imagination.
Let’s just say that if fixed unicycling is accessible to everyone (which is debatable), I don’t think that’s the case for freewheel unicycling at all. For me, it’s a next-level form, a way of reinforcing upper-body balance (educational work, in the same way that a swimmer can work on the flutter of the legs or the movement of the arms with exercises), a way of putting difficulty where there isn’t any left. On the other hand, it’s not spectacular, it’s difficult for the rider, but the difficulty isn’t visible to the uninitiated.
@mowcius perhaps hubs with more pawls may be sufficient. But the nimbus with 3 pawls are not strong enough to ride uphill or jump, certainly they cost 2 times less than the pipipax.
I’m imagining the Bicymple hubs as the more basic cheaper model, which are similar to the JR Drift Trikes hub in engagement (24 compared to the Nimbus 18), but also ISIS.
Although they were never available “new”, only as removed from bicymples to be replaced with two speed hubs, my suspicion is that previously they would have come in around £100-120/piece at a time when the Nimbus ones were £70-80 IIRC.
Riding fire roads downhill, ski lift uphill. That’d be a perfect day for me.
I have a video that I’m not sure I have ever shared here:
For reference, the cameraman rides a 29er with 127 mm cranks. I estimate my speed to be about 30 kph.
IMHO, that’s the perfect place for a freewheel uni. It lets you go downhill really fast, without having to spin your legs. After serious training, I would say that it would be less tiring than riding down a fixed uni, even though this fixed uni would be geared.
I think we agree. It’s great fun to freewheel, and probably even more so in the mountains.
I’m not questioning your use of freewheel at all. I love freewheeling myself. I was talking about efficiency compared to a fixed hub.
Going downhill, whether on the road or off-road, a fixed hub gives you extra control. When it’s very technical or very steep, I think it’s more efficient to use the brake and the legs (so not just the brake). From what you seem to be saying you don’t need that extra control, I hope you don’t.
I agree that when riding over roots, for example, freewheeling can be more fluid. With a fixed hub, your feet can be in a “bad” feet position, which can make the passage less fluid.
Personnaly I practice almost every day. I’m learning to jump kerbs while coasting, it’s very challenging (I’ve never been very good at jumping…). I’m also perfecting my coast by changing the position of my feet and my arms. I’d like to be able to coast backwards, blindfolded or on the beach with a wing, but I’m a long way from that.
I’m not ready to plan a freewheel unipacking trip. Take care!
We may not have the same meaning of “very technical”. However, I would say that you are right when you say that a fixed hub is better for extra control in very technical trails.
Regarding steepness, I feel more at ease with a freewheel. I’m not afraid of letting the wheel go, as I know I’m able to brake when I want to. On a fixed hub, it’s more dangerous as feet have to spin really fast.
That’s why I would say a freewheel hub is not always more practical than a fixed hub. Both have their usage and domain where they prevail. I wouldn’t say one is better than the other for everything. Well, that’s also why the Flik Flok hub was a really great idea for mixing things and use the best mode in every situation
That’s amazing! I’d like to work on the same skill, but I’m still not fully healed. I have to take care of my feet, so I can’t try jumping while coasting. It’s too dangerous as I may twist my feet during a UPD. However, once I’m back on my feet, it’ll be my first exercise!
I don’t agree about the very technical or steep part. As you have seen in the video above from Urs (the art of mountain unicycle freewheeling) he rides more difficult technical parts than I do on my fixed wheel (ok I am old and not that good anymore), but also more (and faster) than his friend in the same age. He still rides a square taper hub with alot of space before it goes back in when he starts pedaling. It’s all about training and practicing. I guess also as long as it is steep enough it’s less tiring for him. On a road he hits easly 40-50 kph
I was thinking about Urs and his freewheeling skills when writing my previous messages. However, I’m still really unsure he wouldn’t ride even harder sections if he got the same training on a fixed wheel that he got on his freewheel. Time will probably tell whether freewheelers will beat fixed wheelers. I hope we’ll have great races at Unicon 22!
races are a different thing: urs joined the open swiss champinship in downhill last saturday and was (alot) slower than some riders (ok like Ben Soja, Timo Hirschmann or Michael Rabensteiner) but that was mostly because of the trail: lot of flat sections or not very steep parts. there were also some real nice sections steep and technical, but over the whole race of 5-7 minutes it was not good for freewheelers. And still he was faster than his friend, who rides the same level on the fixed wheel.
Got back on my freewheel. Much easier than when I started end of last year. I still need to use the brake more than I like and I can’t coast at will. I did get my best distance ever while brake gliding tonight #Kool-aidManOhYeah. I’ve experienced moments where I am able to stop pedaling and coast a little distance without immediately falling forwards or backwards.
I am a lot less herky-jerky (forwards to back to forwards) pendulum riding the brake and more light touches of it to control my position enabling some brief “aha!” moments where the feeling clicked and I got the “so that’s how it feels” feeling. To the point where I was able to arch my back just enough to not fall back but coast. Very infrequent though.
Usually I find myself leaning back more than I should causing me to apply the brake for correction. I do this because it is more comfortable braking lightly to reestablish my body position rather than panic pedaling to avoid falling frontwards and needing to outrun a UPD. Or over pedaling subsequently getting the wheel too far in front.
My question is what can I do to learn to control my center of gravity so it stays at the sweet spot just above the hub? I still ride with one hand on or touching the brake to prevent dismounting.
Side note: I’m slowly gaining comfort with standing and pedaling off the saddle.
It is easier to find the sweet spot with both hands in front of you. If you keep a hand on the bar or saddle, it makes it hard to be stable. However, being unable to brake may feel scary… And it is! You’ll have to run lots of time before being consistent. Good luck!
) and observe how easy or hard it is.
