Why Did You Vote for Who You Voted for?

First and Foremost!!!: I do NOT want this thread to turn into a flame fest. If you find yourself using words like “retarded, asshole, stupid, or idiot” you need to either rethink your post and write a new one or don’t say anything at all. If everyone does this, some real issues and opinions may actually get said without people getting pissed at eachother. So, before you post, read it and think aobut how it would feel to be on the recieveing end of your post. Thank you.

Alright. I know that Bush is gonna win this, although the partisan in me hopes I can be proven wrong. But that’s not the point of this thread…

I want to know why those who voted for who they voted for voted for them (say your reasons for voting for either candidate). I couldn’t vote, but I would’ve voted for Kerry if I could’ve. I would like to hear others’ reasons before I state mine, though.

BTW, the Candidates I know of were:

Gerorge Bush (Republican)
John Kerry (Democrat)
Ralph Nader (independant, as far as I know, but you may as well call him green)
Leonard Peltier (Peace and Freedom party. For those of you who’e never heard of him, he’s a native american political prisioner who’s still in jail. As far as I can tell the only places he got ANY votes from were San Francisco adn Berkeley, Ca.)

I hope we can discuss the issues of this election without anger or rudeness for once.

I voted because I don’t like the way the U.S is going in its foreign policy (to be specific, check out this Sinfest comic. Living in Canada now, I see a lot more news about things that are not immediately pro-US, and how the rest of the world sees us Yanks. And I’ve no right to complain if I didn’t vote. But I did vote. So I can complain! Yay!!!

most of us are kids and our votes dont count…and believe me, that kids vote too is a bunch of bull

I voted for Micheal Peroutka, running for the Constitution Party. I voted for him because I felt he best represents what I believe. If you go to www.constitutionparty.com you can read up on them. Basiclly they’re christian, and believe what I do, which is that you can’t have a country running smoothly that is turning away from God, cause he’s the one that makes things to run the way they should, we’re the ones who try to do it our way and mess things up.

I voted Constitution Party straight across, cause there were other officials being voted on. I’m ok with Bush winning though, I really dissagree with Kerry on a few things, although I know that the president does not have all power, or at least should not, when one branch has more than the other two it makes things run out of line.

Andrew

The way I felt about Bush was simply that I am afraid of having a born agian Christian president. Just as I wouldn’t want a fundamentalist Muslim president or a paraniod president who’s afraid of salt water. Note: I am not trying to compare bush to a mentally ill person. It’s just that the muslim fundamentalist will spend all his/her money trying to convert people to islam jsut as the person afraid of salt water would spend a bunch of money trying to fight it. I don’t want to have a president who involves the personal matter of religion on the international scene. I believe that it is impossible to sympathize, understand, or negotiate with a country like Palestine or Israel if you feel so strongly about religion simply because you are constantly blinded by your disagreements ona fundamental level with their belief systems.

I know this could anger a lot of people, but I also don’t think Bush is a true Christian. Christianity is a good thing in it’s raw essence. It promotes love, happieness, truth, morality, generosity, family values, and most importantly, peace and acceptance. Bush has not attempted to understand, negotiate, or communicate with terrorists, Islamic Fundamentalists, et cetera. that isn’t very accepting. In his defense, it IS pretty hard to negiotiate with someone who hates you enough to kill themselves to kill you, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t worth a try. Bush has been supporting corporate values from the start, which is far from generous to the people who need it. His morality is up for debate, although I think very little of someone’s morales if they have chronically lied about major issues in the world to millions of people. I can’t quote scripture since I don’t have a bible, but i will bet that lieing isn’t veyr Chrisitian. Has Bush attempted to reach out with love or acceptance to Palestinians? What about Russians, who are in the grips of serious terrorist problems, nucler arms control, and poverty. What about the Chechens? The average Chechen and Palestinian doesn’t want to blow up everyone. It’s just a few who do. Nor does teh average russian want to kill the average chechen or the average israeli kill the average Palestinian… wait, I take that last one back. To attempt to understand the perspective of the Chechen people and reach out to them with aid and morality rather than with AK-47’s would cut down drastically on support for terrorists.

There’s also this small technicality of “Thou Shalt Not Kill.” Bush has the blood of over 1,000 American soldiers and 10s of thousands of iraqi on his hands. that is not very Christian.

I don’t agree with Bush on abortion policy simply because I am a man. I cannot give birth. I will never be faced with the dillema of a baby I don’t want. I won’t be pregnant. I cannot understand the feelings of a woman in such a situation, so I feel that I am too ignorant to pass judgement on such a person. Also, I don’t have the right to decide how that woman will live her life. So thus, I shouldn’t tell that woman not to have an abortion. With this in mind, i do feel that simple compassion and ethical rights direct a woman who plans to have an abortion to have it early in the pregnancy. I think she should abort the baby as soon as possible, so as to minimize what the baby will feel. The baby won’t feel pain if it doesn’t have a nervous system, so one could simply have the abortion before it has developed so far. Another aspect of this situation is that abortions will not end. Just as people smoke marijuana although ti’s lillegal, people will have abortions even if it’s illegal. The only difference is that there won’t be licensed doctors and more women will die in the proccess.

I thinkt he gay people have just as much right as anyone else to marry, simply because they should have the right to the benefits that come along with it. If Christians don’t want such unions to be religious, so be it. Leave that up to the preacher, not the government. On the other hand, I don’t feel that I need the government to sanction my parents’ relationship in order for it to be valid. I have gay parents, who have been together for 18 years, and no matter what any government says, they are still my parents and we are still a family. I don’t lack any persepctive on life because of gay parents and dont feel as if a piece of my life is left unfufilled. So all you folks out there who complain that kids of gay parents are lacking in something, I can tell you from firsthand experience that we aren’t. Also, having gay parents does NOT make you gay. 1/10 of the kids who have gay parents are gay, compared to 1/10 of the kids who have straight parents.

The war in Iraq was wrong. Hussein was bad, but to quote a retired senior military general, “To attack Iraq in response to 9/11 would be like FDR attacking Mexico in response to Pearl Harbor.” Hussein was dangerous, but we didn’t have the money, need, military, or, most importantly, exit strategy required to have a successful war in Iraq. Also, a basic rule of thumb in contracting is if you want a good price, you have open bidding on a contract. If you only have 1 bidder, then they can charge as much as they want, which is what halliburton did.

The budget deficit of America is ghastly. Over 20% of american tax money goes to paying interest on the debt. Bush is giving tax cuts to the rich as the poor only get poorer and the deficit only grows larger. That is just fundamentally wrong.

Bush appointed an EPA president who advocating allowing more arseninc ito America’s drinking water. That is just wrong. There’s no two sides to it, you do NOT allow a person who wants to relax the laws governing deadly poisions in water to run an Environmental Protection Agency.

Under Bush, OSHA has only grown weaker, and entire sectors of industry workers qare paying the price. The amount of corporate exploitationof non-unionized workers is horrific. Injuries no longer go punished. Safety standards are unenforced. I notice this inmy every day school day. The ladders in my school, wihc i must climb on adaily basis, are illegal because they are unprotected from the 60 foot drop to the stage below. But the OSHA is too weak to enforce such things.

I won’t continue, since by now I’ve probably lost the attention of everyone who’s read this. But the above is just a few reasons why I disagree with Bush. I haven’t even mentioned the Patriot Act.

I don’t think Kerry’s foreign policy would be any better than Bush’s, except Kerry would be better to our allies and might be able to do better with north Korea. But both candidates have the same terrorism policy and policy on Iraq. Kerry would be less in corporate pockets, and would have better environmental, fiscal, and social policies. But then agian, I could be completely wrong. Too bad we’ll never find out…

Edit: I am also afraid because the Bush administration currently controls all three branches. They have congress, and the presidency. Now they will have the supreme court, too, since at least one of the justices is soon to die, if not two, and because of the republican dominated congress, bush will be able to appoint whomever he wants. I don’t ever want any party to have the freedom thqat the Bush administration currently has. It just isn’t right. Democrat, republican, Green, I don’t care, there should be something to slow down the party, and there currently isn’t.

I voted for Bush, as if anyone here is suprised. I am ecstatic that a majority of the voters agreed with that choice. I voted for him for many reasons.

  1. He is a real person, who cares about America.
  2. He is smart w/o feeling the need to be an elitist intelectual.
  3. He brought us through a really tough time in America’s history.
  4. He is commited to keeping americans safe.
  5. He understands that the money I make is mine to use as I see fit, and not earned by me to make the lives of those who choose not to work more comfortable.
  6. I think he has done a good job the first 4 years considering he took over while America was going into a recesion, and withing 9 months of his taking office had the worst attack on US soil in recent history.
  7. Didn’t feel the need to buy young peoples votes by promising $4,000 in annual aid to college students. That would be $4,000 dollars of other peoples money. (Now if John chooses to do that with his and Ta Re Za’s money that’s fine.)

I am sure there is more, but I am tired and recovering from a cold. I realize that there are 55 million that don’t agree, so don’t feel the need to make this a debate. It won’t do you any good. I have heard all of your arguments, and it won’t change my vote. If the Democrats can bring a better canidate to the table, mabe then I will consider voting another way, but John F Kerry was a ABB canidate, and that is no way to win an election.

First off, Gerble you are a genius. You’re how old?

My vote was no vote. Why? Slightly out of protest for the tens of thousands minority-cast votes that went uncounted. And because the differences between the two candidates where not ample to motivate me. These reasons may sound sophmoric, missguided, and irresposible to you but the electoral process has left me disheartened. To quote Mumia Jamal, “ I wouldn’t be used to make it seem as if I had a fair trial”.

Abortion is here to stay. Just as a democratic government will not revoke the right to bare arms, a republican government will not revoke a woman’s RIGHT to choose, though they both feel strongly in their positions. It’s not going to happen. Clinton was in office for 8 years, can we still own guns? There is no way to justify forcing a woman to birth a child out of incest, rape, inability/desire to support. It just doesn’t make sense.

What people seem to have forgotten, is that the 9/11 attacks where in retaliation of the U.S. involvement in the 1982 Israeli invasion of Lebanon, not that “terrorists hate America”(Bush).
“Bin Laden dismissed the Bush administration’s contention that the attacks were carried out because al Qaeda hates freedom. Bin Laden asks, if we hate freedom --let him tell us then, “Why did we not attack Sweden?”” “He compares the Bush administration and the Bush family to Gulf monarchies and military dictatorships in the Middle East, saying Bush “moved the tyranny and suppression of freedom to his own country, and they called it the Patriot Act, under the disguise of fighting terrorism. And Bush, the father, found it good to install his children as governors and leaders.” –Amy Goodman

Both candidates where anti gay marriage. (Ignorant, or trying to be popular)
Both candidates where pro patriot act. (Unconstitutional).
stem cell research. alright, you got me there.

Florida 2000. Remember that? The majority of the state voted Gore, but the senators gave Florida’s points to Bush. It is not the people who decide a close election, it’s the senators. (Technicality)

Our democracy seems to be a little bruised lately.

Mike

Again, gerblefranklin=genius

I voted for the green party. Months before, I had intended to vote for Kerry, but after hearing the debates, I decided I didn’t like him. He seemed too idealistic, like me. And the thought of someone like me being President frightens me.

The problem with the Republican and Democrat parties are that I agree with some of each of their views, and not overwhelmingly in favor of one or the other. So I figured I’d vote green as a vote for change and because I mostly agree with their platform. Even if a third party doesn’t have a chance, if enough people show their support for certain views, maybe the Republicans or Democrats with adjust their platforms accordingly.

Also, please don’t judge all Christians by what the constitution or repuplican parties say. As a Christian, I believe in caring for the environment, helping the poor, and encouraging peace - three things which the Republican party has neglected.

I voted conservative cause I didnt want the liberals to win again, and I knew I’d be practically throwing away my vote to vote green or NDP (which is what I wanted). But I had to get rid of Scott Brison… that man’s doing nothing being our MP. But I guess this is the wrong country isnt it? I mean that the thread is about…I should be talking about the American election… but I dont know enough to give an opinion on that, and I’m not american so…yes! bah

Choice: Badnarik
Reason: Bill of Rights

am i the only one hearing the refrain “Tax Cuts, Tax Cuts…” echoeing in the backround?
interesting flip bugman, can’t wait to see the flop

hope u get over the cold quickly

First off you violated the spirit of this thread, so I will respond.

Tax cuts are allowing the people who earned the money to keep the money.

School grants are giving money earned by others to those who didn’t earn it. From each according to his means, to each according their needs.

If I choose to vote for a canidate because he values my efforts more than the communist principles, I wouldn’t consider it vote buying. No flipping or floping here. Nice try though. Sad that you don’t understand the difference. Democrats vote to see what goodies they can get from the government. I vote to see what I can prevent the government from taking from me and my family.

if questioning questionable statements made on this thread is in violation of the spirit of the thread, i apologise

Bugman:

Please move to Canada.

And be our Prime Minister

What ever happened to Sofa. He was WAY smarter than this Brian MacKenzie fellow. Paul Martin KNOWS what’s best for you. Why can’t you accept that?

Have you ever thought about moving to the states? You only live about 20 meters from the border anyway. We bowl with BIG bowling balls here. We can go shoot guns in the woods. I’ve got a bunch of them. More than I have unicycles. You should at least come down and visit. Won’t NAFTA let you work here?

That made me laugh. :smiley: So what are the requirements to qualify as outlined in your constitution? Can anyone from North America qualify, or do you have to be a Canadian, eh. I am almost a Canadian, I was born in MN.:smiley:

Agree. But I think same-sex unions need their own terminology. Husband and wife don’t really fit, and you can sure calm down a lot of religious people by calling it something else. I think (hope) that will be the eventual solution, when enough people are ready to be accepting.

When I say “benefits” I mean the legal and financial variety. Tax breaks, estates, hospital visitation, etc. None of this steps on the toes of the Bible or other religious tomes.

You don’t. However, the non-recognized union, as your parents surely know better than me, has no legal standing. So they effectively get screwed on tax breaks, may not be able to inherit each others’ estates when they get old, may not be allowed power of attourney if one becomes very ill, etc. This is the main problem, as I understand it. I think most gay couples are more concerned about that than the actual piece of paper at a wedding or civil union.

But I don’t think this is what the general public hears. The people who are afraid, or who aren’t willing to accept letting others live their own lives, may be more accepting if they are presented with the idea of a differently named union. Marriage is between a man and a woman, and is (in the spirit of the law I suppose) intended as a device to help them raise a family. A same-sex marriage, with some different name, should be no different than a male/female married couple with no kids. Not that they don’t necessarily have kids (obviously). But if I can be married to my wife, with no plans of having kids, why should we be entitled to more legal benefits than your parents?

Technically, we all lack perspective on life. We each only know what we know. You are a city dweller, and if you never lived in the country you lack that perspective. I get the impression that your family does fine finanacially, so you lack the perspective of being poor. Lots of kids are raised by single parents. Surely having two parents, even if they’re not one of each sex, is better than having only one? How hard is it for people to get this? Beyond that, you have to take it on a case-by-case basis. Who here doesn’t know a hetrosexual couple who are bad parents? Being a man and a woman doesn’t automatically make you a worthy “parent set.”

End of agreement rant. I’m not even sure what Kerry’s position on same sex marriage was. To return to topic, I voted for him because he’s not George W. Bush (and because he had a chance of winning, unlike all the smaller candidates).

The big voter turnout was a positive thing, even if they picked the guy you didn’t like. Remember, it was stil 51%… :stuck_out_tongue:

John: I agree with you and I think what you said was great. What I meant by lacking perspective on life because I have gay parents is that my gay parents haven’t stopped me from seeing anything. I wasn’t trying to say I know how it is to live every life. You are right, noone ever will.

Bugman: I’m fine with tax cuts, and I do think a $4,000 tax credit to college students or whatnot is wrong, but for slightly different reasons. Firstly, the way to tax someone is not to say “everyone gives the government $500 per year.” The way to tax someone is to say “everyone gives the government 0.5% of their net worth per year.” This means that everyone is equal. Rich people can afford to pay more, and poor people can’t. Bush has given tax cuts to those people who need them least, and screwed those who need them most. That’s not my idea of fair, and it screws over 99% of the population. Also, a $4,000 credit to a bunch of college students is plain fiscally irresponsible, just as Prop 71 in in California is. We can’t afford to pay for public schools right now,k so where will the money come from to pay for college tuition?

I disagree with you about democrats. I honestly think most democratic politicians are spineless republicans. The people who vote for them aren’t, but the politicians themselves are. I also don’t understand how anyone can agree with privatixing social security, or fight free health care. So what if some people screw the system? Also, it’s all fine and good that Bush is trying to cut taxes, but what makes it okay for him to put us into $500 billion of defacit? 50 years ago republicans were the better party, but now the politicians who run the party (read: Karl Rove, Dick Cheney, John Ashcroft… I don’t mean John McCain, etc.) are just a bunch of fiscally irresponsible facists.

You didn’t lose my attention, thats for sure. Does anyone else go into a political thread hoping to read some of bevan’s posts? :stuck_out_tongue:

I’m curious, do you disagree with your parents on any major political beliefs? Or have you pretty much adopted their views? I believe I’m falling victim to parental influence, as far as politics goes. I suppose this is a bad thing.

Anyone under 25 that holds significantly different political views from their parents, I am curious to know what influenced you to change your ideas. Sorry if this is going too far off topic, ignore me if it is. I like the idea of a clean thread.

-grant

Here is a few thoughts of my own. First, if you live in the US and your physically able, you should contribute to the solvency of this nation. Taxes should not be a disincentive to earn money. If you have a progressive tax that taxes not only what you earn, but what you save from year to year(net worth) you are asking for trouble. What would be the incentive to save, buy homes, build businesses? Just blow it all on crap like $200 tennis shoes, cell phones, and other crap that looses it’s value quickly. Then you can keep more of your money. How about this, if you work real hard in school, and get straight A’s, and one of your friends cuts class and never studies gets D’s we give him half of your grade so he can get B’s and you can get B’s. That way you can both go to college. You keeping those A’s is just greedy. You don’t need A’s to get into college, but he can’t do it with D’s. Sound fair?

Second, how do you determine what somebody needs? I hired a landscaper to keep my yard up for the first time in my life this year. If my tax burden goes up, and I don’t have the extra income, I go back to mowing my own lawn. Who will ultimately be hurt? The guy who is counting on that money to pay his bills, or me who is trading time for money? I’d rather give my money to someone willing to earn it, not someone the government deems more worthy of my money than me.

Steal it from the rich! They don’t need it. How California is short of money is beyond me. My Aunt lives out there, and was talking about her property taxes. My Dad was saying that since her house is paid off her expenses aren’t that bad. He was saying it is a 2% of the property value. At first he was thinking it was $3,500 a year for taxes, then I corrected him and explained that 2% would be $35,000 and he about died. I have seen the property values, and that means there is a crap load of money being spent by local and state governments.

That is just a strange thought.

Funny, I don’t see how anyone would want to throw money into a money pit. Pay for those that we promised it to, and those that are young enough, allow them to invest in funds that can’t be touched by the government. If I set up a retirement account for my employees that paid the return of the Social Security system, I would be in jail for fraud. PS The group that gets the least benefit and pays the most per capita into SS is Black men. When they figure it out, they are going to be pissed.
Free Health care sounds great. Were do I sign up and how much is it going to cost me? No such thing as free. If it is free for you, it is costing someone else, double triple or more than what they get out of it. I suspect that is half of California’s problem now.

I am not a big fan of deficit spending, but there are economists that are much more educated on the matter that say it isn’t a problem. I would be much more comfortable reducing it, but I do understand that there are times when it is necessary to go into debt. Times of war, tragic national disasters etc… When the economy is strong we will pay it back down, just like we did in the 90’s during the internet boom. (which by the way would have to be credited to Gore rather than Clinton. Al Gore invented the internet after all.)

Don’t forget evil. They are evil too. I think I will wait four more years to pass judgment. So back before your parents were born they liked Republicans? Usually you like them more as you age. Actually that does make sense, but I don’t really want to take the conversation into that direction.