Spoke length of splined KH20 as opposed to non-splined

I was just wondering, does anyone know if the spoke lengths on the non-splined and splined 20" Kris Holm Signature unis are the same? I only ask because as soon as I get enough money, I will be upgrading from the non-splined to the splined version. It would be a lot cheaper if i didn’t have to replace spokes as well as hub and crankset. I plan on just getting the hub and crankset because the rim and tire are the same on both wheelsets and I already have them. There would not be much sense for me, a cheap individual, to get parts I already had. Therefore, I need to know if the spoke length is the same on both models before spending my coinage.

If anyone has information in this regard it would be appreciated. Thanks very much!

There is a spoke length calculator at unicycle.uk.com/

You can check the calculated spoke length based on the KH hub and on the standard hub and see if the calculated spoke length is the same.

I’m not sure what the standard hub on your unicycle is (is it a Suzue or a Taiwanese knock off).

For an Alex DX32 trials rim calculated spoke lengths are:
KH hub: 175.83mm
Suzue hub: 175.31mm
Nimbus hub (which I think is a Taiwanese hub): 176.38mm
The hub on your trials uni: unknown

If your uni has a Suzue hub you’re in luck because the spoke lengths are the same. If it’s a Taiwanese hub of strange dimensions it may or may not work out, it would depend on the dimensions of the hub. But from the spoke calculator it looks good.

cool. But I’m not sure if it’s a knock-off or a Suzue. Does it say anywhere on it?

If I can find the actual size of the hub I have on now, then I should be able to see if it matches the KH replacement hub. Thanks for the info!

Generally it is not a good habit to move spokes. I think you’ll find that any decent wheelbuilder will insist on using new spokes. The reason is that the old spokes have adjusted permanently to the stresses they have encountered in the old configuration. In the new configuration, they will not be nearly as strong as they should be. By using old spokes, you risk damaging the wheel, especially the rim, in conditions that the wheel should normally handle.

In any case, this is what the best wheelbuilding books say.

The Suzue hubs say “SUZUE” on them, at least the ones that I’m familiar with.

hub closeup 4 (small).jpg

You can use the same spokes if you don’t want to use new ones.

The KH non-spined unicycles use a Taiwan hub not a Suzue.

I have lots of KH splined hub/crank sets in stock if you are looking for one.
I can build the wheel for you as well if you need that done.

Darren

Thanks everyone. Now that I know it’s possible I will have to make a bit more money. (I just bought a new 17" monitor… it’s so good. And it was dirt cheap at $109 CAD! It was, of course, refurbished, but I haven’t noticed yet.)

I will keep these things in my mind as I draw closer to the point of spline-hood… Thank you all again!

I much prefer to use new spokes but people buying new hubs often seem to have no money left for new spokes too. Perhaps I should insist?

I think it is very important for everyone to inspect their wheels regularly to check all the spokes are evenly tensioned and the wheel is true. This should reduce the risk of damaging the wheel in any case but is probably particularly good advice if the spokes have been reused.

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Without substantial quantitative data on hundreds of wheels and their histories, which I would wager noone on this forum has, including myself, I refer to the experts in the field. Here’s what Jobst Brandt says on pp 116 of the 3rd edition:

  1. <paraphrase> Spokes from a wheel whose rim has been damaged can be reused if the spokes are not removed from the hub, and if they are used in exactly the same way as in the old wheel. That is, using a special technique you can trade identical rims bit-by-bit to obtain a new wheel built in the exact same way.

  2. “Because they have been stress relieved and have acquired a form unique to their location in the hub, they should not be used in new positions in a different wheel. By coincidence some may do well if reused, but the probability of a number of mismatches precludes reuse after lacing.”

  3. “If a rim is to be replaced by a bicycle store, the shop will usually insist that all spokes be replaced as well. The shop will not want the quality of its work measured by possible failures of used and unknown spokes.”

So you see that replacing the hub with a different hub is way off the radar screen. The combination of different stress angles and different fretting places means that the “new” wheel is highly suspect.

Just for argument, let’s say you wanted to reuse the spokes with an identical hub but in the same place, so you actually label the spokes and replace them in the proper place. The extra labor you would have to charge would exceed the cost of new spokes, but now you have built an inferior wheel.

On top of all that, most unicycles are built with straight-gauge spokes, which are much less expensive than double or triple-butted spokes.

So yes, I insist.