However, when we examine his construct of the GOD he does not believe in, it’s not GOD at all!
Surprise Surprise!
No, it’s not GOD Dave does not believe in. It’s actually an idol!
Now Dave actually does not believe in the one particular idol he has mistakenly described as GOD (kind of an angry, mean, nasty idol).
Knowing Dave, I’ll bet he doesn’t believe in ANY idols! Heck, he may be closer to persons of Faith than he realizes. Well, scientists have discovered that this now applies to MANY so-called atheists.
Science does occasionally offer groundbreaking news!
Very interesting threadjack!! While I have enjoyed KrishnaCore Punk music, thanks for sending me this stuff about this. I found the course you mentioned online, here’s the link and the course description.
I’m not surprised that your UU church is interested in feminist, liberal and gay Muslim perspectives. It’s the 2nd class listed:
Islams: Multiplicity in Unity Fall Semester In this class we’ll explore a brief history of Islam and the Prophet Muhammad’s life. We’ll also be introduced to the nature and history of the Qur’an and explore the major branches of Islam: Sunnism, Shi’ism and Sufism, concluding with progressive Muslims’ writings on Islam and its relation to gender, justice and sexuality. These readings will show the diversity and dynamic nature of Muslim communities by representing Islam from feminist, liberal and gay Muslim perspectives. Students will examine “life in religious community and interfaith engagement” by participating in individual field trips, making connections with local Muslim communities and posting their explorations in an online forum. The purpose of these activities is for students to examine the diversity within Islam and to learn from each other by sharing insights and experiences. Through assigned reading, students will examine how Muslims in different corners of the world are dealing with oppression and other social justice issues, as well as the changes brought by feminism, modernism and globalization. Nayer Taheri studied English literature at Tehran University and has focused her study at Starr King on Islamic studies, Sufism and its relation to Unitarian Universalism. She has taught two 3-week classes on Islam for the school. SKOL 4001 3 units Limit: 13
The courses are a bit expensive, though. Why is that?
So uni57’s idea of God doesn’t match Billy’s. What I don’t get is how this makes Billy’s idea of God the correct one? I prefer the biblical version; nice sometimes, and wiping out most of civilization other times.
God is a concept,
By which we can measure,
Our pain,
I’ll say it again,
God is a concept,
By which we can measure,
Our pain,
I don’t believe in magic,
I don’t believe in I-ching,
I don’t believe in bible,
I don’t believe in tarot,
I don’t believe in Hitler,
I don’t believe in Jesus,
I don’t believe in Kennedy,
I don’t believe in Buddha,
I don’t believe in mantra,
I don’t believe in Gita,
I don’t believe in yoga,
I don’t believe in kings,
I don’t believe in Elvis,
I don’t believe in Zimmerman,
I don’t believe in Beatles, I just believe in me,
Yoko and me,
And that’s reality.
The dream is over,
What can I say?
The dream is over,
Yesterday,
I was dreamweaver,
But now I’m reborn,
I was the walrus,
But now I’m John,
And so dear friends,
You just have to carry on,
The dream is over.
What you said reminded me of the movie Expelled. Seen it? Recommended.
The biblical God makes allowances for no other gods. Therefore, if you believe in the God of the Bible, you will not believe in any others. There is no room for wishywashyness.
The True God requires perfection. That is why he would wipe out entire nations: They were wicked. Thankfully, he is also merciful, so that we are not consumed by his wrath. However, he will in the end extract vengeance on all of his enemies. But he has made provision to escape his fiery judgment, thankfully. Otherwise, we would all be headed towards hell.
BTM, I find the idea presented in your first post to be most interesting: some atheists don’t know who they are trying to discredit. Perhaps that is the reason some atheists appear to be successful in debate because they have disproven a god that was never even presented as real, at least not by the Bible.
I think we should all know whom we are fighting against; it helps us know where to throw the punches.
why should those who don’t believe have to discredit/disprove the gods they don’t believe in? i thought the burben of proof was on those making the extrordinary claims? silly me.
Billy, had I responded to your PM, would you not have made this thread?
The God I don’t believe in is the God documented in the Bible. I thought I was always clear on that point. Wasn’t I just talking about the angry, smiting God of the O.T.?
And by the way, if I did believe in God, I think I would be embarrassed to admit it. A magical being created the universe? It boggles this atheist’ mind to think that the majority of the world actually believes such a preposterous idea.
Well, at least John Lennon believes in GOD, and he doesn’t believe in LOTS of things most atheists believe in.
I mean, many atheists believe the historical Jesus existed, as did the historical Hitler, Kennedy, Buddha, etc.
Many of the Faithful besides John Lennon also believe God is a concept,
By which we can measure, Our pain.
He’s not saying GOD is a Pain Intensity Scale.
He’s saying it is only in the presence of the Source of Infinite Compassion (= GOD) that we can tolerate truly taking stock of our pain
The first Universal Truth of Buddhism is “All Is Suffering.” Few can tolerate that Truth.
Thanks for bringing us this reminder of the wonders of GOD and all GOD can do for us, from the wise and great late John Lennon. “And so this is Christmas…”
Dave Lowell: Tune into the muslim punk stuff Raphael posted, and let me know if you’re still stuck on that mean old idol as the “GOD” you choose not to believe in. Muslims have the very same GOD, brought to you courtesy of the Angel Gabriel.
And know that you and I are just the same on that issue. I don’t believe in THAT mean “GOD” (actually idol) either.
As everyone knows there are avenues and branch offs of everything all religions seem to be mixed and matched to so everyone can have exactly what the like (which is why the bible is taken so many different ways). I don’t believe in God, or Gods, I believe in the answers for everything deal with consciences (collective) and quantum mechanics (as well as standard physics, lol). With these two systems an answer (theory) can be created for all questions. It takes thought to come up with answers as well. Unlike most religions where they copout and go with “God”. I think religion in terms of the standard definition hinder human technology and advancement. It may teach morals but I believe there are many ways to do this. Religion is only there for people that need that sort of support/comfort/life meaningness. I’m better knowng i’m here for no reason, i’ll die with no purpose, and i’ll live for no meaning. It’s not depressing if you have your intelligence in check.
This is incorrect (unless you think atheism is a religion). Cuz when you look at China and the USSR and places where atheism is enforced and religion is banned, they are WAY behind technologically.
But check out Japan and the USA where religion flourishes, and so does technology.
Go figure.
And the arts flourish alongside religion, but die under atheism. why is that?
Look at John Lennon, an obviously religions man who wrote that song about GOD that Terry posted here. He was a very creative artist. As was George Harrison, and most of his songs are prayers.
Where would anyone here get a crazy idea like that?
Wow, could it possibly be something else besides the technology-killing atheism? If you don’t know that your “argument” is ridiculous, then, then… I don’t know what. But something.
How about individual examples? This atheist is a kick-ass software developer. Am I an aberration? An exception to your theory?
Good to hear from you! Don’t feel bad about being an aberration. We know you’re on the verge of becoming a person of Faith, and we all admire you taking the same path we all took, asking pointed questions. The best scientists are persons of Faith. Like you, even Einstein indicated he did not believe in idols. That disbelief in idols has brought you closer to us persons of Faith.
Einstein loved how science helped him appreciate Creation. Below are 3 quotes in which he acknowledges he believes in GOD, not idols:
“A knowledge of the existence of something we cannot penetrate, of the manifestations of the profoundest reason and the most radiant beauty - it is this knowledge and this emotion that constitute the truly religious attitude; in this sense, and in this alone, I am a deeply religious man.” (Albert Einstein)
“I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.” (Albert Einstein, 1954)
“I believe in Spinoza’s God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings.” (Albert Einstein)
Hmmm. Lennon was obviously a very philosophical man, but I get more of a picture of an atheist or agnostic from that song, and from Imagine. Someone can post all those lyrics here if they think it’s necessary. He says "I just believe in me (Yoko and me) and that’s reality. That alone would make him a humanist.
