Passion Judging sayaka kan constance cotter iuf and jua politics

THIS IS THE PROPOSAL THEY DID NOT WANT YOU TO SEE
I passionate believe about this issue and I can prove it beyond a reasonable
doubtthis is a quote from John Foss from 2005s rule book committee as a response to
constance cotters proposal for freestyle judging rule changes that in my opinion
proves beyond a reasonable doubt that constance cotter suffers from a massive
conflict of interest and NEVER should have been the result enterer at the UNICON in
Japan in 2004 considering it is likely she has a cultural interest in her own club’s
( and all be it countrys and cultures ) style and the quote is capitialised is
the personal attack on Sayaka Kans style ( and all be it all other Japanese female
styles)"I noticed a few spots that could use some proofing.> 5.2.1 Choreography &
StyleUnder choreography might be a good place to say something about aperformance
that has structure, or a distinctive beginning, middle and end.Though like
everything else these qualities are not required, when used theycan make a good
performance into a great one.> 5.2.2 Originality-performance / Showmanship>
Originality: … High> scores for a unique routine.Suggested edit: High scores for a
unique routine, or one that containsunique elements.> 5.2.3 Interpretation> Costume:
A COSTUME IS CHOSEN TO ENHANCE THE ROUTINE AND DOES NOT INTERFERE> WITH SKILLS.I
think it might be nice to also allow for “costumes that have the potentialto impede
riding, but that the performer successfully adapts to with graceand confidence.” In
other words, flowing skirts can be bad. But if you doall kinds of hard tricks with a
flowing skirt and clearly show you havelearned to handle it, good for you.> Props: A
unicycle, when used for anything but a unicycling skill (handstand on> the unicycle
while it is lying down, hopping standing on the frame with wheel> and seat on the
floor) is considered a prop.This section forgets to mention anything other than
unicycles as props.also here are some facts and quotes

more to come


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For anyone that’s interested, the quote above is from a discussion on the new Freestyle judging system that was proposed in 2005. The quote is about improving that system and is not related to the Freestyle performances in 2004 (which were judged under a different set of rules). That discussion can be found here:
http://www.unicycling.org/iuf/committee/rulebook/2005/proposal.php?id=36

The “proposal they did not want you to see” can be found here:
http://www.unicycling.org/iuf/committee/rulebook/2007/proposal.php?id=39

It does not show up on the IUF Rulebook Committee 2007 page because it awaits approval. The committee chairperson is Constance Cotter. You can say she’s being biased and hoping nobody will post this URL, or you can notice that it’s not a proposal for a rule change, so perhaps it needs to be brought up in a different forum than that one. I would not expect it to see the light of day in a Rulebook Committee discussion.

Simon has been offered a variety of places to find out more about the events surrounding the Freestyle championship in 2004, and the changes we made to avoid or prevent such a situation from happening in the future. Judging results cannot be protested, or changed, after the fact. Only calculation errors can be protested (but not three years later). In 2004 there may have been one or more judges who didn’t properly appreciate what they were seeing, but the results were accurate. Our new system is better.

The two web sites above are how we make updates to the IUF Rulebook (the USA uses the same system). It’s not a perfect system, but it works very well.

What Simon was proposing in the IUF rulebook committee is not actually about changing the rules, rather about changing a result from 3yrs ago. I don’t think the IUF rulebook committee is there to change results.

There may be a conflict of interest, but I don’t think you have a big enough pool of judges that you can choose truely ‘independent’ judges who have no affiliation to any club.

I think that you are implying that the results were altered which is a pretty hefty accusation to make. What evidence do you have to support this?

And as for protesting a result over 3yrs later…surely that is bordering on a little bit late?

Ken Looi

okey

you asked for it

:slight_smile: here we go readdy !!???:wink:

Dear Ken

ken said “What Simon was proposing in the IUF rulebook committee is not actually about changing the rules, rather about changing a result from 3yrs ago. I don’t think the IUF rulebook committee is there to change results.”

well in my mind i was more hoping to change the rules related to changing results if the rulebooks rules were not applied when the judgement was made :slight_smile:

There may be a conflict of interest, but I don’t think you have a big enough pool of judges that you can choose truely ‘independent’ judges who have no affiliation to any club.

I think the chef judge being the couch of both individual winnings and the pairs is a little bit of a conflict of interest :smiley:

I think that you are implying that the results were altered which is a pretty hefty accusation to make. What evidence do you have to support this?

it is a grave accusation having truth on ones side and being a passionate sportsman who be leafs in sportsmanship and being sporting giving people a sporting chance and giving the rule book a sporting change i true lee was too upset and worried by negitive reactions and what my unicycling frirends wopuld think "wpeople form the tcucu espeicaly consistice cotter even… i bit my tounge for 3 years and now i am spiting it out be it on the border of too late

better justice late then “cheating” forever

And as for protesting a result over 3yrs later…surely that is bordering on a little bit late?

Ken Looi

as for prove

proof is

here are some random quotes i collected

Nathan Hoover

“I was too embarrased to kiss her feet”
about Sayaka Kan

from Andy Cotter
it was a random process "we hit the thing 5 times before we got ryan in last place “position in open mens freestyle 2004”

Kasahiro 2004 day before open mens freestyle indivual just after being borken and shattered in the heart shark r a by the TCuC team in the pairs he looks with me at the order of performance and looks at ryan at last place rolls his eyes and shudders or something and gives off the effect of looking like he’d be happy if ether me or him defeated ryan the next day and wished me luck the next day “i embarrasingly enough said nothing with out wishing luck back”

the next day with eyes looking as if he would have been sick/crying all night not being able to win the pairs in his home country just after anouncing his retirement from competing i asked how you are today and he says morbidly

so so

and looks shithouse but still keeping his kin up “gom bel ley” “chin uip in ninhon desu”

I felt sorry i didn’t wish him luck… but at the end of the day i was competiing with him and i didn’t rig the judging

as good a friends as sayaka and kasahiro are I wished that I could place second behind the retireing champion and infrount of the precousis talent

“ether way i was a world champion samwedge”

I truely belive that sayaka should have has a differanty data entry person and chef judge then the couch of her rivals

also I found the custome and music less attractive and the masterly so much lessssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

in amys 2004 routine also Sayaka convided in me personally about how she was “unskilled” and giving up unicycling because she only managed 4th in siwsiland

maybe she would still be competing if and when she is/was awarded crowd favret/ world champion for her home corwd i hope and prey maybe we will see her ride again one day at a world unicycling event and i wish her luck with her teaching career

Simon Thomas Wells

said this sincerely

may I reminded you

I think this is relivent

"please don’t kill there bandwidth "anyone who is clever should post the unicon 12 freestyle acts to youtube… i’m at this moment not clever enough… or maybe people should just watch them spareingly at http://www.ichirin-net.com/video/Unicon12/
and purchase the officail UNICON 12 DVD that io beliave the JUA product prodused

I challange anyone

to view the 2004 routines (bandwitch spar ing ly)
“i’m dislexish don’t worry about it ;)”

and tell me who they think should have won

Ok… I am probably not a big freestyle expert, but a few remark from an outside (european) point of view .
The japanese couple who finished second is truly amazing in terms of presentation, and way higher than the american one in that point. I think the big reproach one can do to their routine is the lack of variety. How many times stand-up gliding ? How many times spin ? My point is, I think that is where they lost: they don’t show many different skills like the others, even if for the ones they show, their mastery is truly amazing.

Would I have been the judge, I would have judged the same.

P.S.: I LOVE both. When I said the Japanese couple “lost”, I meant they won second place…

fair call

how about the female individual

sayaka kan vs amy shilds ?

Apparently in the U.S., all the pathetic whiners go into ice skating; I guess that the Australian whiners, lacking winter and needing an outlet, feel the need to get into freestyle unicycling.

Give it up, please. We’ll install an ice skating rink for you.

Tom dear, thank you for taking the time to check your spelling before posting your rebuttal. Clear and concise communication, correctly spelled, is always appreciated.

On the other hand, Simon, your rambling rants suffer greatly from your lack of care to basic spelling, punctuation, and grammar. What is your point exactly? It is clear you have one dear, but your message gets lost among all the errors. Try to condense it down to the key message, as tholub did.

Some have commented on the (lack of) timeliness of your post, although I think that’s the least of the issues. It is sentences that include passages like “I think the chef judge being the couch” and “ether way i was a world champion samwedge” that represent the true crime.

MA

Well… It’s probably a lot closer than for the pairs. Especially with Amy’s falls. This one may have been tough to judge, but I don’t think the result is scandalous. We can make the same remark as for pair. Amazing presentation from Sayaka, amazing mastery, and even an effort on the diversity of the skills provided. However, the variety of the technical skills is again way higher in the case of Amy, which is probably why she won.

I find the accusation about the chief judge quite disturbing, and I don’t understand how the chief judge could have more influence on the result than any other judge. I guess there were judges from Japan along with judges from the US or other countries. If all the styles were represented here, I don’t see how the chief judge could have changed the results on her own.

The Chief Judge changed/manipulated nothing. In my mind, the only question is whether she should have. One of the seven or eight judges came up with results that were way off from the rest of the group. Connie believed it was not within her power as Chief Judge to eliminate the scores of the one judge, as that could also be seen as “manipulating” the results. But there were more than the required five, so it was, in my understanding of the Chief Judges’ powers, an option that was available to her.

There have been situations in the past, where bad (willing but inexperienced) judges were noticed, and were removed from the panel but not until the end of an age group. In the situation I’m thinking of (Unicon IX), we checked the results at the end of the groups this particular judge had judged, and determined that any “off” marks by that judge did not affect the outcome for those groups. I was the Chief Judge at Unicon IX.

The situation at Unicon XII in Japan was a little different. Not age group, but the Experts. Results in that event could potentially effect careers and future plans for the riders. One of the essential requirements of doing a great Freestyle competition was not up to par; the judging panel. At least one judge on the panel either didn’t have the experience or didn’t understand the rules. OR, possibly this judge just had different opinions (I don’t subscribe to that one, but just tossed it out there).

In any case, we have made improvements to the requirements for being a Freestyle judge. Also we have modified the rules to throw out the high and low scores from each judge when tablulating scores.

If Simon has a proposal for a rule improvement, we’re still ready to hear it and work with him to polish it as a new addition to our Rulebook. Until then, random quotes and exchanged glances unfortunately do not add up to evidence of anything. I exchanged glances and spoke to those riders also. It’s terrible if competition results are one’s reason for discontinuing the sport, but that is a personal choice. If those riders had a beef with the judging process or results, surely we would have heard from them by now.

Both John Foss and Connie Cotter have addressed these issues in helpful ways in this thread

Funny; Amy Shields is an American figure-skater, but somehow I’m not surprised I haven’t noticed her whining about above issue.

All whiners are figure skaters. Socrates is a figure skater. Therefore: ?