It doesn’t make sense that bi polar is a new disorder, so maybe we called it something else in the past or simply ignored it, but now it’s the number one mental health diagnosis.
So, what do you all think, is bi polar an excuse for not controlling/taking reponsibility for your behaviors or is it something more?
Bi polar is a splendid excuse for all forms of inappropriate behavior. It’s also a good description for a rotating sphere as well as a variety of magnets.
I didn’t know Bi-polar was new, I’ve heard the term for many years. Maybe relatively new? Anyway, a diagnosis is not an excuse for bad behavior. It can be a reason for such behavior, but this never makes it okay.
For example:
“Well, your honor, I’m Bi-polar and forgot to take my meds. This was why I went on a screaming rampage in the plane.”
I work with people with developmental disabilities. In many cases, our folks also have various types of mental illness. If you know it’s there, you really shouldn’t be using it as an excuse. If you commit crimes as a result, the penalties should not be any less. Perhaps less if you were not yet diagnosed, but not if you knew you had this condition and, for example, simply didn’t take a prescription med that can help with your symptoms. That happens a lot.
It used to be called manic depression, so that makes it a lot less new. At least as ancient as Jimi Hendrix 
Bi polar is a term I first heard when I set foot in the US of A. I also happened to have never heard of it after I left. Strange.
I bet Nurse Ben thinks AIDS is just an excuse for calling in sick to work.
Kay Redfield Jamison, a clinical psychologist and author, was diagnosed as bipolar in the seventies, I believe. If you want to read a brilliant book about manic depression/bipolar/etc “An Unquiet Mind”, her memoirs, is just that.
Bipolar/ADD/ADHD/Asbergers/autism diagnoses all seem to be on the rise. I think there are a lot of reasons for this, but one that I think is often overlooked is that we are simply getting more nuanced in how we describe mental illnesses or mental conditions. None are excuses for bad behavior; however they can offer a key to understanding behavior in some cases.
Sam
I have heard of bipolar since the 80’s
It’s hard for me to say if it is an excuse for bad behaviors. I have dated 2 bipolar (so they said) girls, and they both seemed worried at times and also prone to sudden mood swings. In general, they make kinda crappy girl friends. It’s hard to know if they want to fuck or fight, and especially confusing when they seem to want to do both, or change their mind in the middle.
I do believe it is a real disorder. Not saying I am an expert, but just as a guy that loves hot girls, they suffered from worries about their condition. They both told me they took drugs, Lithium sounds like what they said.
One girl I have known 20 years and she loves me a lot so I always want to say hi to her. However, she is on the 3 minute rule. She is great for 2 minutes, but gets pissed off before 5, doesn’t matter what I do, say, or don’t say. Make her laugh in 2 minutes and then bail. If I stay, she suddenly get’s offended and leaves anyway, angry, so I have learned to be nice, and leave earlier than her.
If Louis de Funès was born today he’ll probably got medication, and would have ended at the assembly line of Peugeot’s mopeds. That is, if those jobs weren’t outsourced to China. Do they actually have ADHD in China to?
I think those who claim they “suffer” ADHD are either fakers or too lazy to see their trendy handicap as a benefit.
Probably not, being as I used to work in an Aids Hopsice and have done a lot of AIDS education…but at least you’re trying 
A disclaimer, I practice psychiatry, so bi polar is a diagnosis I see often; too often IMHO. What I find challenging is when clients or their families come to an appt insisting that they be medicated for bi polar. In psychiatry, a diagnosis is only relevant if it can be treated with medication, so when medication doesn’t work …
And yes, bi polar was once called manic depression and depression was just depression, but now they have it divided into all sorts of special categories; which is what happens when psychologists have too much free time 
So, without “cheating”, guess which of the above diagnoses are most common statistically?; yes Harper, all statistics lie, but bear with me 
Do the folks who see you know you’re only practicing? When will you take this job seriously? I almost lost a bipolar friend to suicide in high school…
Bad behavior?
When they change their minds in the middle, that can really ruin a good fight:D
It can make some people Not Criminally Responsible for Criminal Conduct, known as the Insanity Defense.
It is sad to hear about suicide, even an unsuccessful attempt is a terrible shame.
Fortunately in a decade of doing this work I have only had one patient complete, but I talk to patients about suicidal thoughts far too often…most of the time it is either a comment taken out of context or a person saying things they don’t mean. But of course we have to take everything serious, because you never know if it is serious.
When I first started doing this work, the number of people coming in with a diagnosis of bi polar was not very great, maybe 1-5%, but now it has grown so large that it dwarfs all other diagnoses, upwards of 1/3 of the patients I see will “suggest” bi polar as a diagnosis. And for my part, all I can do is talk through the diagnostic process and discuss “norms” and how one thing can appear to be another…
What I find most interesting is that in the child and adolescent population it is almost always the parent that insists the child has bi polar, but with adults it’s the adult who claims to be bi polar. Now maybe this makes sense at one level, but try talking with a parent about a differential diagnosis, bi polar vs oppositional defiant or ADHD and watch how fast the parents get irritated! Oh, and gawd forbid you suggest anything to do with parenting!!
I once had this parent come and demand I medicate her sixteen son because he was rude, disrespectful, did what he pleased, refused to follow her directions, etc… In the process she was disrespectful and condescending to me, so when I suggested to M that they get some family therapy and work on relationship issues, she stormed out of my office, leaving her son behind, then she demanded he be scheduled with someone else.
So much of what I see is not treatable with medications, I don’t mean to say that I refuse to try medications, but after trying a bunch of diferent medications without a positive response, there can really only be one answer…it’s behavioral.
There is a move underfoot in psychology to add an Axis II diagnosis to the DSM that represents the population of people who have the symptoms of a mood disorder that are not treated by medication, with the assumption being that their mood problems are rooted in their thinking processes vs their bio chemistry.
The reason I started this thread was that during a conversation last week with a psychiatrist, he suggested the same thing: “… bi polar has become an excuse/explanation for bad behavior.”
So, do you think we change the ways we think about things in order to change the ways in which we respond?
Harper, such a funny guy, and yes bad behavior is a common thread, but the most common Axis I psychiatric diagnosis is ADHD/ADD, though this often “evolves” into other things as the kids age out…
I’ve read the thread and find it especially interesting since my lifemate, my older boy (7 yo) and I have been going once a month to see a psychologist since last january.
It was really helpfull and the process is nearly over.
We felt there was a problem and our boy wasn’t feeling good, neither were we because there was like something broken between us and him. It was tiring, stressfull and the cause of many conflicts.
We ALL grew up with the process, and we’re glad we took the decision to go and see someone who could help us (it has been hard to find one, though).
I NEVER thought medication could be an answer to our issue. For parents, asking for medication is much easier than questionning our parenting, as Nurse Ben mentionned.
Anyway, for my information, I’d really like to know what ADHD/ADD means. Can someone enlight me on this?
Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder/ Attention Deficit Disorder. Labels/diagnoses often given to difficult to control youngsters.
Stephen Fry, a bipolar sufferer himself, made a really good programme about his experiences with bi-polar, it’s well worth a watch. The most interesting thing he and the others he spoke to in the programme said was that they wouldn’t give up the lows if it meant they also had to give up the highs.
I was talking with a friend the other evening in the pub who has bi-polar about the thinkings of Thomas Szasz, a psychiatrist who argues against the medicalisation of behaviour/mental illness and against the coercive power available to mental health practitioners. We have a couple of mutual friends that are libertarians and are both keen on Szasz’s idea that mental illness is behaviour; things people do rather than something people have. My friend couldn’t apply that thinking to her own experiences - couldn’t believe that she was making a choice to feel the way she does when going through a manic or depressive episode.
Having worked on psychiatric wards for a couple of years I’ve seen people who, perhaps as a result of being labelled so by professionals that are trained to see everything through the prism of illness and recovery, exhibit behaviours you’d associate with mental illness but who seemed to me at least to have some element of control or even calculation behind their actions. I think that might be down to the environment of a (usually under-staffed) psychiatric ward where the people the receive the most attention are those with the strongest symptoms which, perhaps on a sub-conscious level, might encourage people to act in a way most likely to get them attention or affection. We’re intensely social creatures. Being starved of attention and affection can cause “madness”, I think.
But then I’ve seen a lot of people who quite evidently are not in control of their actions and are a danger to themselves or others because of this. Another very good friend of mine also suffers from bi-polar and some of the things he’s done during a manic phase I know for a fact he wouldn’t have chosen to do so if he were feeling his usual self. Once he was tackled to the ground by several cops after parading around his neighbourhood fully nekkid and reading passages from a book. At least the cops got to find out what a bi-polar bare looks like.
This was an interesting read for me. It chimed strongly with what I saw on the psych wards as well as my own anti-authoritarian tendencies and how they’ve effected decisions I’ve made and pretty relevant to this discussion I think.
Thanks, Mr Boggie.
I’m not in the medical/psychiatric business but this seems to make sense.
Interesting, indeed.
They probably don’t “have” ADHD in China. They also don’t commonly treat basic illnesses like Chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, in spite of the fact that probably more people suffer from COPD than anywhere else in the world, thanks to lots of air pollution and a high smoking rate. Perhaps holding China up as an example isn’t so good.
Both my son and I “suffer” from ADHD, so I have some opinions on the topic. My son was diagnosed when we took him to a psychiatrist, against our better judgement but on the recommendation of his 2nd grade teacher. I knew he would be diagnosed with ADHD, as I have a particularly dysfunctional family and there is a hereditary component to this condition. Sure enough he was diagnosed as having “textbook” ADHD and the psychiatrist then recommended we put him Adderal, the most common ADHD medication prescribed to kids
My response to the psychiatrist was: “you’re implying that there is a hereditary root to his condition - does that mean you’d diagnose me as having same thing?” after he affirmed, I suggested he evaluate me, and if I did indeed have the same condition, start me on meds first. He agreed.
After a couple of visits to the psychiatrist on my own, the diagnosis was positive, and I was put on Concerta, a time released form of Ritalin. It is a very interesting drug - sort of like having all the positive effects of coffee with none of the negatives. I found I was more alert, able to focus and stay on task better, and noticed an improvement in my short term memory. I didn’t see any negative side effects at all.
I kept taking this for a couple of months before giving it to my (then) 8 year old. It had the same effect on him, and watching him he seemed…calmer when he was on the drug. But I started noticing that I was beginning to feel like this drug was really helping me - how could I ever have functioned without it? This seemed to hint of addiction, so I stopped. When I saw that I could function perfectly well without it, I also stopped giving it to my son.
So - here are some of my thoughts and conclusions on ADHD and drugs in my family:
ADHD is a real condition, and people with ADHD have a unique set of issues to deal with. But, like many psychological conditions, there are varying degrees ranging from having a minor focusing issue to extremes; my brother has relatively severe Asbergers, which I believe is related to the ADHD diagnoses in the rest of our family. Explaining to my son how to deal with the ways he thinks differently from others using ADHD as a frame has been very useful; he (and I) see is as a way of understanding our relationship with the world, not as an excuse to misbehave.Modern medication definitely has a positive effect on many of the …err…characteristics of ADHD. In our cases they did not “dull” us, make us obedient, or stunt our creative ability in any way. The only negative I noticed after several months of use was a level of addiction akin to what I have with coffee. Many people with more severe ADHD really need these drugs to function well in modern society, particularly in modern public school classrooms. But these drugs are also performance enhancing drugs - they make pretty much anyone who takes them more focused and improve memory, though maybe not to the same extent as they do with an ADHD patient. The question for me was: where do we draw the line between addressing a problem and enhancing performance?
In our case I made the decision that my son and I both could function w/o the drugs. We have since moved my son into a small private school and he excels there; for us this was a better way to address the academic and social issues that started us down this path. But if he were still in his old school there’s a good chance he’d still be on ADHD meds - like, incidentally, over 20% of his male classmates were! Bottom line is they work and it’s a good tool to have in reserve, but both my son and I choose to deal with our issues on our own.
One of the mates I mentioned in my earlier post recently read An Unquiet Mind. They absolutely loved it, I’m going to give it a read soon.
They’ve also become very much interested in how diet can be used to maintain their mental health and have been much more happy since tailoring their diet and taking supplements to boost things low levels of which are associated with depression, and retard the things that can cause sleeplessness and mania.