Help with Offroad Unicycle?

All,

I had been looking at getting a better street cycle, probably the SemCycle XL 26". However, on Monday, Chris and I went offroad unicycling. It was my first time. I am totally hooked, and so my plans for getting another street cycle are being shelved for now. After all, my united trainer works fine as a street cycle (though I do wish I had a 26").

What should I look for, as a beginner, in an offroad unicycle? I weight 240 lbs, and I am 6’1".

I don’t want to spend $1000 on a unicycle, or more, but I might be willing to spend up to $600 or $700. Oh, and I will be buying from Unicycle.com. So, my price range pretty much eliminates the profile cycle, and definitely eliminates the Hunters, and all but the low end of the Wilders.

I just don’t know where to start.

I do know that I won’t be doing too many hops or drops … I havent even learned to hop yet. I will only be doing what I need to do to get through the trail and enjoy it. I’m not one of those out looking for maximim punishment on the trail, I just want to be able to ride.

I will answer any other questions, if you can think about anything you want to know that might help your recommendations.

One specific question I have is this: since the Miyata seats are on back order now, what is the next best (or are there better?) seat to get for offroad riding? I rode 3 hours on my Miyata seat with no troubles.

Thanks for your help,

Lewis

Re: Help with Offroad Unicycle?

Sorry to followup my own post. The edit time had expired.

I am not planning on hot-dogging it, but I guess I should get a cycle that is capable of bearing repeated hops with my weight (240 lbs) just because I have seen Chris in the field, and frequently he comes up to something and hops 5-6 times to line up to hop up onto something. I want my cycle to be able to handle that, since if I ever need to rely on that as a technique, I don’t want to damage the cycle.

Lewis

Lewis-

No one seems willing to tell you what you want. You need a girlfriend…she’ll tell you what you want. Maybe if you quit telling people how big you are they would quit worrying about giving you the wrong advice and then having you show up and pound them. I know you wouldn’t try to beat anyone up because if your mom found out, and she would, you would be toast.

I’ll start the ball rolling by advising you to do something I myself would do but most others will argue against…then you’ll get some input from them.

You have a United trainer that cost you … what … nothing? Do whatever you want on the United along the lines of off-road or trials riding until you break it and see what breaks. Is it the wheel? The cranks? The axle? Then you know what a big, tough guy like you needs beefed up to survive.

THAT’S RIGHT! I’M TALKIN’ TO YOU. BRING IT ON, BIG GUY!

That’s what I did with my cheap Savage. Obviously everything on that Uni was going to break sooner or later, but it was the wheel that went first. From that I bumped up to a United with a Monty wheel and Miyata saddle. Now I’m starting to get into the area where I’ll have crank/hub problems… Profile time. Then it’ll be the seat or a Coker.

Tough order to fill… still…

You are stuck with Profile crank/hub set-up unless you are willing to periodicaly replace broken parts- which you are not. So we can assume:

http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=2&subcat=13&cat=Profile+Racing&L2=Axles+and+Hubs&L3=Profile+Racing

$349

Moving right along- tire size. 24 x 3" Gazz is effectively a 26" wheel, but still has the rim streangth of the smaller wheel. While there are several rims worth considering, the streagth and pinch flat resistance of the Sun Doublewide makes it your main choice. You might consider a 26 x 2.6" wheel for greater speed on the trails with a marginal sacrifice to manuverability and streangth. So you might as well concead:

http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=2&subcat=34&cat=Off-Road+Combinations&L2=Wheelsets&L3=Off-Road+Combinations

Bringing us to $559. And you’ll need some of these pedals:

http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=2&subcat=23&cat=Odyssey&L2=Pedals&L3=Odyssey

Which at $24, raises the total to $583.

Big cost savings can be had on the frame. In a few months, The Source might have Nimbus 2 frames that can accomodate these wheels, for about $50 (not firm). You could use your existing seat and post with that, bringing your total to only $633+ shiping ($13 ish).

Let’s pretend you’re not willing to wait 3 months for a frame… then you are looking at the low end frames in stock that meet at least some of your preferances- the Sem XLW is just such a frame:

http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=2&subcat=22&cat=Semcycle+XL&L2=Frames+and+Frame+Parts&L3=Freestyle+and+Street+Frames&L4=Semcycle+XL

$55 for a 26" frame. Let’s continue to fantasize that you will restrict yourself to 6" drops and light hopping- then add this 48 spoke wheelset:

http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=2&subcat=34&cat=Suzue+48-hole+Hubs&L2=Wheelsets&L3=Suzue+48-hole+Hubs

Surely a 26" wheel that would put up with you (assuming the axel does no fail at the taper) for $155. I have some 175mm alluminium cranks that you could have, so add $24 pedals, $45 Gazz, $10 tube, and your existing seat/post- clocking in at $289.

Yawn; night,

Christopher

Harper,

Thanks! It helped. Funny post as well. :slight_smile:

Chris,

My biggest problem is that I don’t want to custom order anything, I want to just “buy one right off the web page.”

I may have to sacrifice that requirement though.

At the price you quoted ($583 + $289), I may as well just buy the Offroad Profile cycle they have on the site.

Lewis

Get the best unicycle you can afford. It doesn’t really matter
what you’re capable of doing now, because you’ll always
improve and want more from your Uni, unless you quit.

When you’re buying your first unicycle, you may not be sure
whether you’re going to continue with it for a long time,
so it makes sense to be more budget-minded. But after
you’ve become addicted, it’s different.

I can’t hop yet either, but I still went with the Profile
setup. I figure, nobody’s going to razz me for having
more Muni than skills, least of all the mountain-bikers
and hikers I meet on the trails, most of whom have
never seen a Muni before.

I agree with the idea of going with a Profile hub and Sun Doublewide.
That’s how my muni is equipped. If you can get that put into a Semcycle
XLW frame, it won’t take a 3" wide tire but a 2.6" should fit, which is
what the Pashley Munis run. Looks like Rhysling put it all together as
far as cost goes. I would recommend that setup as well, based on what I’ve
broken. If you get a street uni, shoot for a 48-spoke hub with a Sun BFR
rim. That’s what my Semcycle 26" will be getting as soon as I make it a
priority.

You’ve never responded to my posts that I can remember (I know, there
are a lot of them but I do want you to know this), so I’ll mention again
that I’m just about your size and I’ve already broken my 26" Semcycle XL
with minor hops and drops. The rim is bent beyond truing and one of the
spokes is bent. The cranks seem to have survived, and they’re 150s. I
hear that Dan Heaton (obviously not a heavy guy) uses 127s because he ends
up bending anything longer. Problem is, with a muni it’s better to have
the longer cranks for more torque. My riding buddies have 170s or 175s on
their Pashley Munis with a 26" wheel. I’m getting 160s with a 24" Sun
Doublewide on a Profile hub.

Make sure you do spend the money to get something that you don’t have to
worry about breaking. I found myself constantly tensing up, thinking
about what might break if I dropped off a curb or hopped the uni at all.
It held me back from concentrating on improving my skills, so I decided to
get something that I knew would hold up to a lot of abuse.

John

Animation wrote:

> All,
>
> I had been looking at getting a better street cycle, probably
> the SemCycle XL 26". However, on Monday, Chris and I went offroad
> unicycling. It was my first time. I am totally hooked, and so my plans
> for getting another street cycle are being shelved for now. After all,
> my united trainer works fine as a street cycle (though I do wish I had
> a 26").
>
> What should I look for, as a beginner, in an offroad
> unicycle? I weight 240 lbs, and I am 6’1".
>
> I don’t want to spend
> $1000 on a unicycle, or more, but I might be willing to spend up to
> $600 or $700. Oh, and I will be buying from Unicycle.com. So, my price
> range pretty much eliminates the profile cycle, and definitely
> eliminates the Hunters, and all but the low end of the Wilders.
>
> I
> just don’t know where to start.
>
> I do know that I won’t be doing too
> many hops or drops … I havent even learned to hop yet. I will only
> be doing what I need to do to get through the trail and enjoy it. I’m
> not one of those out looking for maximim punishment on the trail, I
> just want to be able to ride.
>
> I will answer any other questions, if
> you can think about anything you want to know that might help your
> recommendations.
>
> One specific question I have is this: since the
> Miyata seats are on back order now, what is the next best (or are
> there better?) seat to get for offroad riding? I rode 3 hours on my
> Miyata seat with no troubles.
>
> Thanks for your help,
>
> Lewis
>
> –
> Animation
> Posted via the Unicyclist Community - http://unicyclist.com/forums

John B,

Thanks for the help. I did see your other post on the XL as well.

So, are you saying that for both a street cycle and a muni that you would recommend the profile hub and cranks, and the sun doublewide rim? Or is the Sun BFR rim you mentioned on your street cycle different from the doublewide?

I’m OK with paying more. I have decided I love unicycling, so I am willing to invest in it. I just want to talk it out with others and to myself before I make a purchase.

My next decision (assuming you recommend the Sun doublewide and the Profile setup for both a street cycle and a muni) is on how big my Muni tire should be. Chris keeps telling me that I should go with 24", because with a fat tire, it will feel like a 26". Well, maybe, but I also know that both on-road and off-road, on my 24", I feel like I am making tiny, tiny baby pedals most of the time, and I wish for more … rarrr! ya know?

So I at least think I want to consider long cranks for my muni. Could anybody discuss the pros and cons of longer cranks and of a 26" muni with a big tire instead of a 24"

I kind of like the look of the Profile Offroad Uni on unicycle.com. http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=111 I assume that the cranks and hub are Profile. It has the sun doublewide rim. The only things I see “wrong” (maybe) with it would be that it is a 26" which Chris is against and that the frame only supports up to a 2.6x26" tire, not a 3.0x26. Also, I don’t know how long the profile cranks are, and isnt the Miyata seat out of stock?

Of course, I notice the bad boy himself (Kris Holm) has a 24" setup on his, so that must mean something, right? :slight_smile:

By the way, I see under the Profile Offroad (which one would assume has the Profile Hub and Cranks) that the text says it is the “David Poznanter” hub. So, is he the Profile guy? Does that mean that the Hunter cycles that mention Poznanter Hub also have Profile? In other words, does Profile = Poznanter?

If so, then this model would seem to have everything that has been recommended to me:

http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=102

Then it would be up to the details on 24" vs 26" and the fatness of the tire and the crank arm size.

Thanks for the continued help, everybody!

Lewis

I would recommend the Sem XLW 24 inch. I weigh 185, and my XLW has
held up to lots of abuse. The 24x 2.6 tire is pretty big, and the Suzue
hub is very strong. You can always upgrade to a profile hub later,
which is what I will be doing some day. Joe in Iowa

-----Original Message-----
From: rsu-admin@unicycling.org ["]mailto:rsu-admin@unicycling.org] On
Behalf Of Animation
Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2002 1:38 PM
To: rsu@unicycling.org
Subject: Re: Help with Offroad Unicycle?

Sorry to followup my own post. The edit time had expired.

I am
not planning on hot-dogging it, but I guess I should get a cycle that
is capable of bearing repeated hops with my weight (240 lbs) just
because I have seen Chris in the field, and frequently he comes up to
something and hops 5-6 times to line up to hop up onto something. I
want my cycle to be able to handle that, since if I ever need to rely
on that as a technique, I won’t destroy anything.

Lewis

Animation wrote:
> I do know that I won’t be doing too many hops or drops …


Animation

I would loose your requirement about not customizing stuff. Unicycle.com has no problem switching parts around.

I would steer clear of the Profile MUni. besides the hub, it doesn’t have ideal MUni parts. The Hunter is very good. You could also get a KH frame (better IMHO, and only a couple dollars more) and put that on 24x3.0 Profile wheelset (the same as the Hunter). The only problem with the KH frame is that you can’t fit a normal Miyata post in it. You would have to get a Bicycle rail type post, which needs a Wilder rail bracket, which doesn’t fit on a regular Miyata seat (it was meant to, but the currant batch doesn’t), so you would need a carbon fiber seat frame.

You will want that seat eventually, but its a lot of money up front.

As for Pedals, I would recommend Snafus. They grip your feet better than any other pedal I have tried, and they’re very tough also.

Hope this helps

Ben

  1. The 2 prices listed were for 2 cycles, not 1… so they would still be markedly less costly than the Profile, which 2) I would not recommend for the same reasons as Ben. 3) I don’t recommend the 24 x 3 over the 26 x 2.6- they just have different perposes. Your antisipated use might recommend the 26 x 2.6 (getting from point A-B off road, as aposed to jumping over everything between A and B). The 24" should be easyer at climbing. 4) Going with the 26 x 2.6 does not preclude the Profile " Poznanter" Hub and Doublewide set up… I just listed the 26" with a Suzue Hub as an example of price options. 5) Longer crank arms will help you on climbing AND HURT YOU ON SPEED. For an excellent rant on Crank length, read this:

http://www.muniac.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=10&t=000045

that said, a larger wheel size will result in slower foot speed for distance traveled, allowing for the luxury of longer cranks and the increase in leverage they afford. 6) Take John’s story of wheel destruction to hart- as for recommended street uni, the 48 hole wheel precludes the use of a Profile hub- so that should answer that question. My only qualification on that recommendation is that you don’t plan on doing more than 6-8" drops/hops. I think my axel failed as much from pre-hopping as the vault or landing- so don’t expect it to last forever, regardless…

Christopher

See how complex this becomes, Lewis? Ride the United until it breaks…then decide. You may not be able to get a replacement United, though…I think their mechanics are on strike.

Oh, ya, and:

Con: 26" =weeker wheel than the 24
Pro: 26" =faster than 24
Con: 26 x 3" =heavy
Pro: 26 x 2.6 =weight savings/agility
Con: 26 x 2.6 = less padding on impact meens you may take more of it on the cranks/axel…

:slight_smile:

Christopher

Chris,

I don’t think I know enough yet to really take so many recommendations from you without getting confused. :slight_smile:

On your two quotes above, don’t they disagree? Or is the “for distance travelled” mean something? I don’t get it.

I will go read the link you provided about crank length anyway.

Harper,

Yes there are too many options. I just want to ride offroad with a minimum of breakage. Is that so much to ask? :slight_smile:

I may just go with the 24" tire size on the offroad, just because it will be stronger and because I will likely get a 26" for my next street cycle.

Thanks to all,

Lewis

This Is a correction to something that was posted.
The Wilder bracket WILL fit on the Miyata Seat, The Current batch is just a little tight. Don’t let that discourage any one though, it will go on with a little elbow grease. I can drill the holes a little larger when You order one, which should make it slide on easily.
My Bad, I told someone on the phone that it was hard to get it to fit. It works fine on the carbon seat base.

I would go with the 24" wheel for MUni, and then buy something a bit bigger for a streetable Uni. I was in the process of setting up a MUni, but due to limited terrain and my progress in the areas of hopping, stairs, skil levels and what not I decided to go with a 20" United/Monty for now. From there you can always plan to add to the family. Don’t expect to have just one super Uni. I was planning on getting the Profile cranks/hub for my United eventually but I’d also like to pick up a Coker and a giraffe in the mean time, not to mention modifying the Miyata seat to an air/carbon. Too much stuff to do, not enough cash.

All,

I will probably go with the 24" tire, now I just need to decide what crank length.

Also, thanks to some cycle elitists out there (that’d be almost all of you :)), I am doubting the Hunter. What advantage does the Wilder have over the Hunter? I can’t get the KH because a) I dont want the brake and b) I’d feel arrogant ordering it.

Also, if I got the top end Wilder (groan), do I have to get it in black? There is no color choice there. I want that pretty sky blue frame. I’d like blue pedals and a blue seat also, tho I guess there aren’t any blue miyata seats now.

Also, since the miyata’s are out of stock, what would I get from unicycle.com?

And now that the Gazz tires seem to be going away (or is that rumor), what will I get instead?

I guess I should call them up.

Seriously, I can just see spending $1000 on the hunter, and I can even see why I should, but the wilder for $300 more … what are the advantages?

Man I hope my computer doesn’t die anytime in the next six months because I have a new, MORE expensive hobby. I never thought I would have a hobby that surpassed the cost of computers, but here I am. :slight_smile:

My short term goals are to get a nice offroad and a nice street cycle. I’m looking at $1500 - $1800 depending on which 2 I get.

Heh, time to cancel my cable I never watch (but not cable modem) and the 2 online games I never play anymore … I will save like $55 per month. :slight_smile:

Lewis

This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

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I agree. Try the Suzue hub and if it breaks, big deal, it costs next to
nothing. Then you can upgrade to a Profile.

The Suzue hub is very strong; people on this list complain when it breaks
after multiple four foot drops, but what do they expect?!? (note: these
are <240 lb. riders) The Suzue will also give you greater options when
choosing cranks and it is much lighter than the Profile setup. Right
now your best bet for cranks are the Kooka DH cranks from Unicycle.com.
Some say that 170mm cranks with a 24x2.6 tire is too long, but only if
you ride long, flat trails. For aggressive downhills and steep ascents
you will love the extra leverage the 170’s give.

Jeff Tuttle

On Wed, 20 Feb 2002 08:33:22 -0600 “Joe” <tommy@osage.net> writes:
>
> I would recommend the Sem XLW 24 inch. I weigh 185, and my XLW
> has
> held up to lots of abuse. The 24x 2.6 tire is pretty big, and the
> Suzue
> hub is very strong. You can always upgrade to a profile hub later,
> which is what I will be doing some day. Joe in Iowa
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Ben,

you wrote:
> get a Bicycle rail type post, which needs a Wilder rail bracket,
> which
> doesn’t fit on a regular Miyata seat (it was meant to, but the
> currant
> batch doesn’t)
So what does the current Wilder rail bracket batch fit? Viscount or only
a carbon fiber (because you can drill your own holes)?

Jeff


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