Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

Let’s talk about unicycle racing. Here goes…

I think we should start racing on 700C wheels. Adults racing on 24" wheels
no longer makes sense. It did when that was the biggest size available for
unicycles, but not any more. Now anyone with a phone (in the USA or UK
anyway) can order one with a wheel size up to 28" or 29". That’s 700C.

700C is the size designation for road bike wheels. It does not represent
millimeters or centimeters. It’s more just a designation.

700C wheels were used in the Ride Across Minnesota. They’re great for road
riding. There are tons of choices of rims and tires. All you need is a
longer unicycle fork.

Why not race Cokers? Though I also like big wheel racing, it doesn’t work on
a track. If you’ve ever tried to ride a big wheel unicycle around an
athletic track, you may have noticed a difficulty in keeping it in the lane
on the curves. I think it would exceed a reasonable level of safety, as well
as be much harder to get permission to do it on tracks. Big wheel racing
should be done on the road.

700C racing would be faster, more exciting, and more fun to watch than 24"
racing. Yes, it would be more dangerous as well, but not by much, in my
opinion. You will still be going within the range of running speed, and the
types of crashes we have would stay about the same.

A move to 700C racing might get people to decide how serious about racing
they really are. I think most of us are not, and yet we take up three days
of track time at every UNICON and a good two days at NAUCC. Maybe a lot of
us are only entering because it’s the only thing on the schedule for those
times. Adding a new wheel size might help us see who’s really interested in
track and who isn’t.

I’m saying that because I think we can have a lot more fun at our
conventions than by cramming the schedule with competition events. I’d like
to see less of those and more fun stuff for everybody.

I propose we add one or more 700C races to the next (2003 and later) NAUCC
and UNICON. An informal demonstration might be possible at the conventions
this summer, but I was not planning on that (nor are the hosts). I don’t
even own a 700C unicycle yet. We would have to work out the details.

What do you think?

Stay on top,
John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
2002 NAUCC and UNICON Referee
jfoss@unicycling.com

Go to NAUCC and UNICON 2002! www.nwcue.org

John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
jfoss@unicycling.com

IF IT DAMAGES PUBLIC AND PRIVATE PROPERTY,
SKATEBOARDING
AND UNICYCLING
IS A CRIME
(Mind where you grind)

:slight_smile: Bring it on!
:wink: John, any chance this is a ploy to set some new world records?
Seriously though, I think this would be a good step for the “sport” of unicycling. Speed gets peoples attention. As John already mentioned, the equipment is available and I believe one could find a lot more rim and tyre selection in the 700c range.

A couple of my thoughts regarding potential rules:
*eliminate crank length restrictions. If we’re weeding out the not so serious racers, those are the ones who wouldn’t take the time or effort to optimize their rides.
*I think we might even be able to eliminate the “roll out” for wheel diameter for the same reason, just as long as the wheel has a 700c size classification on the side.

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

> I propose we add one or more 700C races to the next (2003 and later) NAUCC
> and UNICON. An informal demonstration might be possible at the conventions
> this summer, but I was not planning on that (nor are the hosts). I don’t
> even own a 700C unicycle yet. We would have to work out the details.
>
> What do you think?

I like it. However, I don’t own a 700C unicycle yet either. That would give
me a good reason to “need” one.

Is the ultimate goal of unicycle racing to demonstrate who can GO the
fastest or who can PEDAL the fastest? If it is the former then we should
allow any size wheel/crank. If it is the latter then a “standard” size
needs to be agreed upon. In either case I’m in favor of whatever JF says.
:wink:

-mg

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

Somehow i don’t like the idea of changing the standard wheel size.
Too many people has been using the 24" wheels for too long and will be
hard to change that now.

Not a lot of people have 700Cs, and besides… it is not fair to have
different wheel sizes on races (28" & 29").

Of course, I don’t object adding open events if the organizers don’t
mind (but I see it unlikely since we have been so tight in our schedules).

Take care,

Javier


Javier Ruiz
javruiz@onebox.com



---- John Foss <john_foss@asinet.com> wrote:
> Let’s talk about unicycle racing. Here goes…
>
> I think we should start racing on 700C wheels. Adults racing on 24"
> wheels
> no longer makes sense. It did when that was the biggest size available
> for
> unicycles, but not any more. Now anyone with a phone (in the USA or
> UK
> anyway) can order one with a wheel size up to 28" or 29". That’s 700C.
>
> 700C is the size designation for road bike wheels. It does not represent
> millimeters or centimeters. It’s more just a designation.
>
> 700C wheels were used in the Ride Across Minnesota. They’re great for
> road
> riding. There are tons of choices of rims and tires. All you need is
> a
> longer unicycle fork.
>
> Why not race Cokers? Though I also like big wheel racing, it doesn’t
> work on
> a track. If you’ve ever tried to ride a big wheel unicycle around an
> athletic track, you may have noticed a difficulty in keeping it in
> the lane
> on the curves. I think it would exceed a reasonable level of safety,
> as well
> as be much harder to get permission to do it on tracks. Big wheel racing
> should be done on the road.
>
> 700C racing would be faster, more exciting, and more fun to watch than
> 24"
> racing. Yes, it would be more dangerous as well, but not by much, in
> my
> opinion. You will still be going within the range of running speed,
> and the
> types of crashes we have would stay about the same.
>
> A move to 700C racing might get people to decide how serious about
> racing
> they really are. I think most of us are not, and yet we take up three
> days
> of track time at every UNICON and a good two days at NAUCC. Maybe a
> lot of
> us are only entering because it’s the only thing on the schedule for
> those
> times. Adding a new wheel size might help us see who’s really interested
> in
> track and who isn’t.
>
> I’m saying that because I think we can have a lot more fun at our
> conventions than by cramming the schedule with competition events.
> I’d like
> to see less of those and more fun stuff for everybody.
>
> I propose we add one or more 700C races to the next (2003 and later)
> NAUCC
> and UNICON. An informal demonstration might be possible at the conventions
> this summer, but I was not planning on that (nor are the hosts). I
> don’t
> even own a 700C unicycle yet. We would have to work out the details.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Stay on top,
> John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
> 2002 NAUCC and UNICON Referee
> jfoss@unicycling.com
> www.unicycling.com
>
> Go to NAUCC and UNICON 2002! www.nwcue.org
>
>
>
>
> John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
> jfoss@unicycling.com
> www.unicycling.com
>
>
> IF IT DAMAGES PUBLIC AND PRIVATE PROPERTY,
> SKATEBOARDING
> AND UNICYCLING
> IS A CRIME
> (Mind where you grind)
>

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

Hello,

>Too many people has been using the 24" wheels for too long and will be
>hard to change that now.

I think so too. most Japanease unicyclist doesn’t like it.
Maybe, many woman can’t ride 28,29 inch unicycle.
People of Asia are smaller than Europeans and Americans.

I think 24 inch is jast size.

>>700C racing would be faster, more exciting, and more fun to watch than
>> 24"

How does the danger accompanied by it cope with it? and If the chenge
rules, How can we get 700C?

>From: “Javier Ruiz” <javruiz@onebox.com>
>To: John Foss <john_foss@asinet.com>
>CC: “‘rsu@unicycling.org’” <rsu@unicycling.org>,
“‘iuf-rules@unicycling.org’” <iuf-rules@unicycling.org>,
“‘usa-rules@unicycling.org’” <usa-rules@unicycling.org>
>Subject: Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more
interesting?
>Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 21:50:14 -0700
>
>Somehow i don’t like the idea of changing the standard wheel size.
>Too many people has been using the 24" wheels for too long and will be
>hard to change that now.
>
>Not a lot of people have 700Cs, and besides… it is not fair to have
>different wheel sizes on races (28" & 29").
>
>Of course, I don’t object adding open events if the organizers don’t
>mind (but I see it unlikely since we have been so tight in our schedules).
>
>Take care,
>
>Javier
>
>–
>***************************************
> Javier Ruiz
> javruiz@onebox.com
> http://www.masajistapr.com
> http://www.javier-ruiz.com
>****************************************
>
>
>---- John Foss <john_foss@asinet.com> wrote:
> > Let’s talk about unicycle racing. Here goes…
> >
> > I think we should start racing on 700C wheels. Adults racing on 24"
> > wheels
> > no longer makes sense. It did when that was the biggest size available
> > for
> > unicycles, but not any more. Now anyone with a phone (in the USA or
> > UK
> > anyway) can order one with a wheel size up to 28" or 29". That’s 700C.
> >
> > 700C is the size designation for road bike wheels. It does not
represent
> > millimeters or centimeters. It’s more just a designation.
> >
> > 700C wheels were used in the Ride Across Minnesota. They’re great for
> > road
> > riding. There are tons of choices of rims and tires. All you need is
> > a
> > longer unicycle fork.
> >
> > Why not race Cokers? Though I also like big wheel racing, it doesn’t
> > work on
> > a track. If you’ve ever tried to ride a big wheel unicycle around an
> > athletic track, you may have noticed a difficulty in keeping it in
> > the lane
> > on the curves. I think it would exceed a reasonable level of safety,
> > as well
> > as be much harder to get permission to do it on tracks. Big wheel
racing
> > should be done on the road.
> >
> > 700C racing would be faster, more exciting, and more fun to watch than
> > 24"
> > racing. Yes, it would be more dangerous as well, but not by much, in
> > my
> > opinion. You will still be going within the range of running speed,
> > and the
> > types of crashes we have would stay about the same.
> >
> > A move to 700C racing might get people to decide how serious about
> > racing
> > they really are. I think most of us are not, and yet we take up three
> > days
> > of track time at every UNICON and a good two days at NAUCC. Maybe a
> > lot of
> > us are only entering because it’s the only thing on the schedule for
> > those
> > times. Adding a new wheel size might help us see who’s really
interested
> > in
> > track and who isn’t.
> >
> > I’m saying that because I think we can have a lot more fun at our
> > conventions than by cramming the schedule with competition events.
> > I’d like
> > to see less of those and more fun stuff for everybody.
> >
> > I propose we add one or more 700C races to the next (2003 and later)
> > NAUCC
> > and UNICON. An informal demonstration might be possible at the
conventions
> > this summer, but I was not planning on that (nor are the hosts). I
> > don’t
> > even own a 700C unicycle yet. We would have to work out the details.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > Stay on top,
> > John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
> > 2002 NAUCC and UNICON Referee
> > jfoss@unicycling.com
> > www.unicycling.com
> >
> > Go to NAUCC and UNICON 2002! www.nwcue.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
> > jfoss@unicycling.com
> > www.unicycling.com
> >
> >
> > IF IT DAMAGES PUBLIC AND PRIVATE PROPERTY,
> > SKATEBOARDING
> > AND UNICYCLING
> > IS A CRIME
> > (Mind where you grind)
> >

Yuuichiro Katoo


e$B%$%s%?!<%M%C%H$r$b$C$HJXMx$KMxMQ$9$k$J$ie(B MSN Explorer
http://explorer.msn.co.jp/

RE: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

> -----Original Message-----
> A move to 700C racing might get people to decide how serious about racing
> they really are. I think most of us are not, and yet we take up three days
> of track time at every UNICON and a good two days at NAUCC. Maybe a lot of
> us are only entering because it’s the only thing on the schedule for those
> times. Adding a new wheel size might help us see who’s really
> interested in track and who isn’t.
>
(rsu readers, sorry for the repitition, there’s some new comments here and
I’m sending this to the IUF and USA discuss groups)

Bring it on!
John, any chance this is a ploy to set some new world records? :wink:
Seriously though, I think this would be a good step for the “sport” of
unicycling. Speed gets peoples attention. As John already mentioned, the
equipment is available and I believe one could find a lot more rim and tyre
selection in the 700c range.

If we are going to continue towards Olympic glory I think we need to make
technological advances as well. The advance in wheels that can be made with
700c wheels would be huge. As a former bicycle road racer I’ve always
wished I could use road bike equipment for unicycle. If we can relate more
to the bicycling industry, we will improve our chances of recognition and
development of equipment.

Some additional comments, before you all jump to conclusions about John’s
proposition, please read all his comments carefully. I do not think there is
anything unfair about an increase in wheel size. The equipment is available
if someone is serious enough about racing. It’s about time for the major
manufacturers to increase their options anyway.

I don’t believe the size of a 700c tyre is large enough to eliminate shorter
riders. I think it would be fairly easy to make a uni with a 700c wheel
where the top of the seat is only 17inches (43centimeters) from the center
of the axel. With 125mm crank arms it would be 22inches (56 centimeters) to
the end of the crank arms at the bottom of the pedal rotation. I’ve seen
some shorter people doing just fine on 36inch cokers, I don’t think there
are too many vertically challenged people who would have trouble with a 700c
wheel.

A couple of my thoughts regarding potential rules:
*eliminate crank length restrictions. If we’re weeding out the not so
serious racers, those are the ones who wouldn’t take the time or effort to
optimize their unicycles.
*I think we might even be able to eliminate the “roll out” for wheel
diameter for the same reason, just as long as the wheel has a 700c size
classification on the side…Or it might be nice to restrict people to the
narrow, high pressure, high performance wheels that are found on the cycles
used in the Tour de France.

Dustin Kelm
Unicycling Productions
5533 Malibu Drive
Minneapolis MN USA 55436-1035
tel 952.930.9648
fax 415.329.1587

For all the Unicycles you ever dreamed of: www.unicycle.com

isa40:29.31

One thing to consider is that it is more difficult to fly with a 700c unicycle than a nice compact 24" unicycle. Could be an issue for some, especially if you need to bring a 20 for freestyle, a 24 for wheel walking races, a 700c for track, a muni, and a novelty uni. That’s a lot of baggage.

john_childs

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

Hi together!

There have been many opinions about your mail John! It’s a very interesting idea
and radical idea. The Swiss are might again a little bit advanced in this
discussion because we have races with bigger wheels for 30 years now.

I try to write a most possible objectiv comment and tell you of my experience
by commenting Johns mail including the other comments.

John Foss schrieb:

> I think we should start racing on 700C wheels. Adults racing on 24" wheels
> no longer makes sense. 700C is the size designation for road bike wheels. It
> does not represent millimeters or centimeters. It’s more just a designation.

About WHEEL SIZE:

Generally I support your opinion. But I would like to talk about the exact wheel
size and not about the rim size. Because I support Dustins Opinion that you have
more available HIGH TECH material when you use a classical Bike wheel size!
That’s just a fact.
Japan with how many Unicyclists Yuichiro? about 10 Milions? has really good
special Unicycling tires because mass production make sens with so many
Unicyclists. But in the rest of the world the number of Unicyclists is not that
high and so we have not special good Unicycling tires also because theres no
chance to get the tires from Japan!

With bike wheel size everybody in the world could have competitive material!!!
This would be good for international Unicycling developpment!

For Bicycle races you generally use on the road the 700C rim with a tire about
18mm to 23mm. A really rideable tire for a Unicycle is the 23mm (622-23) tire.
This is a diameter of about (I’m sorry may one ore two mm wrong) 66.8cm. For Off
Road (MTB Races) 26" rims are used with up to 3" tires for downhill and between
1.75" to 2.15" for cross country. With this cross country tire dimensions you
have about the same wheel size as the 28" road race tires are! With a
limitations like this we would not change the actual use of wheels. Today Some
like (the Japanese and Chinese) the more stable and easy rideable 24" wheel with
the big tire and some (European for example) like the 26" wheel and little
tire. In both ways the same wheel size is possible (61.8cm actual rule). With
the change to bicycle races we have the same situation one wheel size; one size
“higher”. 28" rim with little tire or 26" with big tire. But now with bike
equipment!

> Though I also like big wheel racing, it doesn’t work on
> a track. If you’ve ever tried to ride a big wheel unicycle around an
> athletic track, you may have noticed a difficulty in keeping it in the lane
> on the curves. I think it would exceed a reasonable level of safety, as well
> as be much harder to get permission to do it on tracks. Big wheel racing
> should be done on the road.

About Track Race And Safety

John, track races with this wheel size works very well! But I can imagine that
people wich always used 24" have little problems to ride the curve with a 26" or
28" because in Switzerland we have some great 26" (comparable to 28" with little
tire) racers wich just did not get how to ride on a 24" wheel. And most of the
problems they have in the curve with the 24" wheel!!! And with the 26" they
just ride the curve perfect! So it needs time and training.

But it really works as well on the track!

The question on safety is a real problem. I remember many hard injuries with 26"
races. It’s just more dangerous! But never, really never somebody hitted with
the head on the ground. It’s Dangerous for the knees and hands (wristle). This
is what we use now for safety equipment. A helmet is for nothing because you
fall to the front if you fall. The problem is mostly (no always) that your mind
wants to ride faster as your legs can do. And then you lean to the front …
your legs don’t go the speed…you fall to the front.Then you could heart
(I’ve never sean) your chin. But helmet (exept of special downhill helmet) don’t
protect your chin. You can also loose your grip on the pedal but then you also
don’t fall on the back side of your head.

And I don’t want to wear a big downhill helmet in a track or road race. It’s too
hot and uncomfortable. NOTE: this is my personal opinion and not a most possible
objectiv like the rest of my mail is!

With the the limit of 66.8cm wheel size I say we just reach the limit of what we
can risk. Here we come to the limit were people can ride faster as they can run.
When I fall on the 26" in Full speed I always have to do a gymnastic roll for
not to risk an injury. To use even shorter cranks would be dam critical and very
risky. Then you can not run if you fall down and I don’t think there are many
other unicyclists wich learned to fall down as good as I had to.

>
> 700C racing would be faster, more exciting, and more fun to watch than 24"
> racing. Yes, it would be more dangerous as well, but not by much, in my
> opinion. You will still be going within the range of running speed, and the
> types of crashes we have would stay about the same.

With even shorter cranks 28" Unicycling would may be the sport number one on
“CRASH and FUN TV” wich shows the worst and unbelievablest crashes ever seen. I
imagine if there’s no red track to race on it soon would be! But realistic we
have do it more spectacular but not silly risky. The other point is: Why is
Unicycling races interesting to view. It’s the speed you have and the high rpm
on a “normal crank size”. With too big wheel and short cranks the rpm goes down
(vision effect) too much and it may don’t become as spectacular as you think.
with 66.8cm it becomes remarquable faster but the rpm does not
break down.

>
>
> I’m saying that because I think we can have a lot more fun at our
> conventions than by cramming the schedule with competition events. I’d like
> to see less of those and more fun stuff for everybody.
>

This is one point of view. The other may even more important to make unicycling
an olympic sport is to make it more spectacular for the public. ONLY IF WE HAVE
MUCH MORE VISITORS, THERE’S A CHANCE TO BECOME OLYMPIC!
This could be a step forward!

Yuichiro Kato wrote:
>I think so too. most Japanease unicyclist doesn’t like it.
>Maybe, many woman can’t ride 28,29 inch unicycle.
>People of Asia are smaller than Europeans and Americans.

>I think 24 inch is jast size.

Please don’t forget Yuichiro has to represent about 10 Milion Unicyclists! We
all represent less! But I agree with Dustin that all the Japanese can ride the
66.8cm wheel.
May not the children. A solution could be still to do 24" races for the young
people?
20" from 0-10, 24" from 11-12 Years. and a category 28" 0-14 Years? Then people
can choose.

With 28" The the physical condition becomes more important as it is now.
Marc

P.S. This is my comment to that proposal and not the one of the SUF. But we will
discuss about it next meeting.

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

I very much agree with Javier.

Carol Brichford

On Tue, 11 Jun 2002 21:50:14 -0700 “Javier Ruiz” <javruiz@onebox.com>
writes:
> Somehow i don’t like the idea of changing the standard wheel size.
> Too many people has been using the 24" wheels for too long and will
> be
> hard to change that now.
>
> Not a lot of people have 700Cs, and besides… it is not fair to
> have
> different wheel sizes on races (28" & 29").
>
> Of course, I don’t object adding open events if the organizers don’t
> mind (but I see it unlikely since we have been so tight in our
> schedules).
>
> Take care,
>
> Javier
>
> –
> ***************************************
> Javier Ruiz
> javruiz@onebox.com
> http://www.masajistapr.com
> http://www.javier-ruiz.com
> ****************************************
>
>
> ---- John Foss <john_foss@asinet.com> wrote:
> > Let’s talk about unicycle racing. Here goes…
> >
> > I think we should start racing on 700C wheels. Adults racing on
> 24"
> > wheels
> > no longer makes sense. It did when that was the biggest size
> available
> > for
> > unicycles, but not any more. Now anyone with a phone (in the USA
> or
> > UK
> > anyway) can order one with a wheel size up to 28" or 29". That’s
> 700C.
> >
> > 700C is the size designation for road bike wheels. It does not
> represent
> > millimeters or centimeters. It’s more just a designation.
> >
> > 700C wheels were used in the Ride Across Minnesota. They’re great
> for
> > road
> > riding. There are tons of choices of rims and tires. All you need
> is
> > a
> > longer unicycle fork.
> >
> > Why not race Cokers? Though I also like big wheel racing, it
> doesn’t
> > work on
> > a track. If you’ve ever tried to ride a big wheel unicycle around
> an
> > athletic track, you may have noticed a difficulty in keeping it in
> > the lane
> > on the curves. I think it would exceed a reasonable level of
> safety,
> > as well
> > as be much harder to get permission to do it on tracks. Big wheel
> racing
> > should be done on the road.
> >
> > 700C racing would be faster, more exciting, and more fun to watch
> than
> > 24"
> > racing. Yes, it would be more dangerous as well, but not by much,
> in
> > my
> > opinion. You will still be going within the range of running
> speed,
> > and the
> > types of crashes we have would stay about the same.
> >
> > A move to 700C racing might get people to decide how serious about
> > racing
> > they really are. I think most of us are not, and yet we take up
> three
> > days
> > of track time at every UNICON and a good two days at NAUCC. Maybe
> a
> > lot of
> > us are only entering because it’s the only thing on the schedule
> for
> > those
> > times. Adding a new wheel size might help us see who’s really
> interested
> > in
> > track and who isn’t.
> >
> > I’m saying that because I think we can have a lot more fun at our
> > conventions than by cramming the schedule with competition events.
> > I’d like
> > to see less of those and more fun stuff for everybody.
> >
> > I propose we add one or more 700C races to the next (2003 and
> later)
> > NAUCC
> > and UNICON. An informal demonstration might be possible at the
> conventions
> > this summer, but I was not planning on that (nor are the hosts). I
> > don’t
> > even own a 700C unicycle yet. We would have to work out the
> details.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > Stay on top,
> > John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
> > 2002 NAUCC and UNICON Referee
> > jfoss@unicycling.com
> > www.unicycling.com
> >
> > Go to NAUCC and UNICON 2002! www.nwcue.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
> > jfoss@unicycling.com
> > www.unicycling.com
> >
> >
> > IF IT DAMAGES PUBLIC AND PRIVATE PROPERTY,
> > SKATEBOARDING
> > AND UNICYCLING
> > IS A CRIME
> > (Mind where you grind)
> >


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Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

I very much agree with Javier.

Carol Brichford

On Tue, 11 Jun 2002 21:50:14 -0700 “Javier Ruiz” <javruiz@onebox.com>
writes:
> Somehow i don’t like the idea of changing the standard wheel size.
> Too many people has been using the 24" wheels for too long and will
> be
> hard to change that now.
>
> Not a lot of people have 700Cs, and besides… it is not fair to
> have
> different wheel sizes on races (28" & 29").
>
> Of course, I don’t object adding open events if the organizers don’t
> mind (but I see it unlikely since we have been so tight in our
> schedules).
>
> Take care,
>
> Javier
>
> –
> ***************************************
> Javier Ruiz
> javruiz@onebox.com
> http://www.masajistapr.com
> http://www.javier-ruiz.com
> ****************************************
>
>
> ---- John Foss <john_foss@asinet.com> wrote:
> > Let’s talk about unicycle racing. Here goes…
> >
> > I think we should start racing on 700C wheels. Adults racing on
> 24"
> > wheels
> > no longer makes sense. It did when that was the biggest size
> available
> > for
> > unicycles, but not any more. Now anyone with a phone (in the USA
> or
> > UK
> > anyway) can order one with a wheel size up to 28" or 29". That’s
> 700C.
> >
> > 700C is the size designation for road bike wheels. It does not
> represent
> > millimeters or centimeters. It’s more just a designation.
> >
> > 700C wheels were used in the Ride Across Minnesota. They’re great
> for
> > road
> > riding. There are tons of choices of rims and tires. All you need
> is
> > a
> > longer unicycle fork.
> >
> > Why not race Cokers? Though I also like big wheel racing, it
> doesn’t
> > work on
> > a track. If you’ve ever tried to ride a big wheel unicycle around
> an
> > athletic track, you may have noticed a difficulty in keeping it in
> > the lane
> > on the curves. I think it would exceed a reasonable level of
> safety,
> > as well
> > as be much harder to get permission to do it on tracks. Big wheel
> racing
> > should be done on the road.
> >
> > 700C racing would be faster, more exciting, and more fun to watch
> than
> > 24"
> > racing. Yes, it would be more dangerous as well, but not by much,
> in
> > my
> > opinion. You will still be going within the range of running
> speed,
> > and the
> > types of crashes we have would stay about the same.
> >
> > A move to 700C racing might get people to decide how serious about
> > racing
> > they really are. I think most of us are not, and yet we take up
> three
> > days
> > of track time at every UNICON and a good two days at NAUCC. Maybe
> a
> > lot of
> > us are only entering because it’s the only thing on the schedule
> for
> > those
> > times. Adding a new wheel size might help us see who’s really
> interested
> > in
> > track and who isn’t.
> >
> > I’m saying that because I think we can have a lot more fun at our
> > conventions than by cramming the schedule with competition events.
> > I’d like
> > to see less of those and more fun stuff for everybody.
> >
> > I propose we add one or more 700C races to the next (2003 and
> later)
> > NAUCC
> > and UNICON. An informal demonstration might be possible at the
> conventions
> > this summer, but I was not planning on that (nor are the hosts). I
> > don’t
> > even own a 700C unicycle yet. We would have to work out the
> details.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > Stay on top,
> > John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
> > 2002 NAUCC and UNICON Referee
> > jfoss@unicycling.com
> > www.unicycling.com
> >
> > Go to NAUCC and UNICON 2002! www.nwcue.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > John Foss, the Uni-Cyclone
> > jfoss@unicycling.com
> > www.unicycling.com
> >
> >
> > IF IT DAMAGES PUBLIC AND PRIVATE PROPERTY,
> > SKATEBOARDING
> > AND UNICYCLING
> > IS A CRIME
> > (Mind where you grind)
> >


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Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

different divisions? why not have 24" and a 700c races held? works fine with
most other sports.

__
Trevor andersen

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

John Foss <john_foss@asinet.com> wrote:

>Of course assuming we do keep limits on wheel size and crank length, we will
>have to establish what they are. This should be determined with an
>understanding of the products that are available in the world’s major
>unicycle racing countries.

Any off the shelf (mass produced) parts may be used. Only “one of a
kind” custom parts should be prohibited, if even that.

Any off the shelf part available anywhere in the world, is available
anywhere else on the world, given a sufficient supply, willing shipping
company and enough money to ship, pay for customs, pay for currency
exchange and other fees. In other words, we must not get too concerned
with what is locally available at reasonable prices everywhere around
the world, otherwise we will be mired down by detailed lists of what can
and can not be used.

In my opinion, there should not be any limits on unicycle design and
contruction of unicycles used in most competitions. Some races could
retain wheel and crank size limits as almost all races are now defined.

A combination of the best unicycle and rider will win. You can be sure
that the winner’s unicycle will be copied and improved for following
years competitions. Since, the rider is the engine, the rider will be
the overwhelming factor in any best combination of unicycle and rider.

As a pratical saftey consideration, wheel size may have to be limited to
about 28" or anything with 700C on it. Crank arm length should not be
limited, so riders can use a crank arm length that they consider optimal
for themselves. This is not possible with a fixed limit of say 5"
(127mm). Currently, riders with long legs may have an advantage, since
their optimal crank length is legal, while shorter rider’s optimal crank
length is may not be legal, because it may be less than 5" (127mm).

Sincerely,

Ken Fuchs <kfuchs@winternet.com>

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

In article <mailman.1023941906.1947.rsu@unicycling.org>,
Ken Fuchs <kfuchs@winternet.com> wrote:
)
)A combination of the best unicycle and rider will win. You can be sure
)that the winner’s unicycle will be copied and improved for following
)years competitions. Since, the rider is the engine, the rider will be
)the overwhelming factor in any best combination of unicycle and rider.

A decent rider on a Coker will beat the best rider on a 24" in a speed
race every time. Two riders of equal ability on a 28" vs. a 29", who do
you think will win?

Technological advancement has destroyed tennis and is in the process of
destroying golf. We shouldn’t be Luddites and deny all advances, but
neither should we expect everyone to buy a uni.5 just because they want
to compete in speed races.
-Tom

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

“John Foss” <john_foss@asinet.com> wrote in message
news:mailman.1023906688.29238.rsu@unicycling.org
> Hmm. The Olympics is also a place where athleticism is what they want to
> see, and not technical advantage. In other words, as long as we’re
thinking
> Olympics (which we are), we probably have to stick with some sort of
> limitations.

The Olympics seems like a long shot to me, how many countries have regular
racing meets at all? I think for the olympics you need something like 30-50
countries to be having national competitions. This is maybe like the people
on rec.juggling who want juggling to become an olympic sport?

I guess Japan and America, maybe Germany and probably not anywhere else have
racing? The UK convention I went to was a lot more relaxed than all that and
there weren’t any track races at all.

Joe

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

“Tom Holub” <doosh@inl.org> wrote in message
news:oSVN8.8467$Dn3.48285@dfw-read.news.verio.net

> Technological advancement has destroyed tennis and is in the process of
> destroying golf. We shouldn’t be Luddites and deny all advances, but
> neither should we expect everyone to buy a uni.5 just because they want
> to compete in speed races.

Yes, I don’t reckon how serious people are should be judged by how willing
they are to buy the latest whizz bang unicycle. Thinking of the best
unicyclists I’ve met, a whole lot of them are kids or people who ride old
pashley 24" unicycles and stuff. At hockey practice we get some amazing
riders who are pretty fast too, but most don’t have anything bigger than a
20" or 24". Personally I’d rather see it go the xc mountain bike way, where
some people still win races on bog standard bikes rather than the road bike
way where all the bikes ridden seem to be insanely expensive.

Where the technological advances might come in handy though is for people
who want to compete with all sorts of cyclists rather than just other
unicyclists, for example in mountain bike racing which it seems quite a few
people do on unicycles now. In the more technical races where you can’t ride
a coker, a 29" wheel could stop you taking absolutely ages and making anyone
you came with wait so long for you to finish. Although I don’t think it’ll
mean coming that much higher up the rankings though!

Joe

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

John Foss <john_foss@asinet.com> wrote:
> Let’s talk about unicycle racing. Here goes…

> I think we should start racing on 700C wheels. Adults racing on

Interesting. I think I like this idea. Increasing the max wheel size would
alow people to make use of newer technology and probadly lead to more
custom biuld, or at least fewer off the peg unis in the hands of racers.

I like the idea of races getting faster, it might put some casual racers
off racing at Unicon. Thus freeing up more time for the important things
in life, like muni rides and Unicycle hockey.

Another sugestion, loosly linked to this one. get rid of or seriously
downsize kids raceing at Unicon. I’d like to see under 14s racing in just
one class. Maybe with a smaller wheel max than the adults. If Unicon is a
world championship race seris, it should be concentrated on the Adult
racers who have chosen to be there, NOT on the kids who are either racing
because there is nothing else to do that day OR they are being pushed by
parents or Club leaders. The keen kids will still race in an open under
14s class. The less keen will not.

Leave junior raceing where it belongs at local and maybe national
level. Under 14s shouldn’t be expected to be WORLD CLASS in anything,
theres plenty of time for that when they are older and can chose for them
selves what is important.

sarah

Unicon 11 ~ Washington USA.~ July 25 - Aug 2 2002
The world unicycle convention and championships.
http://www.nwcue.org

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

compeating on uni.5s would be fun though. as its own division, and only
after harper has found somebody to massproduce his product and is making his
millions.

which brings up another question, when is harper planing on finding somebody
to massproduce his product and begin making his millions? everybody realizes
this is somethign that MUST happen right? for the sport of unicycling??

__
Trevor andersen

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

>In article <mailman.1023941906.1947.rsu@unicycling.org>,
>Ken Fuchs <kfuchs@winternet.com> wrote:
>)
>)A combination of the best unicycle and rider will win. You can be sure
>)that the winner’s unicycle will be copied and improved for following
>)years competitions. Since, the rider is the engine, the rider will be
>)the overwhelming factor in any best combination of unicycle and rider.

doosh@inl.org (Tom Holub) wrote:

>A decent rider on a Coker will beat the best rider on a 24" in a speed
>race every time. Two riders of equal ability on a 28" vs. a 29", who do
>you think will win?

>Technological advancement has destroyed tennis and is in the process of
>destroying golf. We shouldn’t be Luddites and deny all advances, but
>neither should we expect everyone to buy a uni.5 just because they want
>to compete in speed races.

My point is that serious racers will choose to use the best possible
cycle staying within whatever the rules dictate. So, even though the
restrictions on the cycles may be opened up, the cycles used in
competition will be close to optimal as current racing cycle design
permits and thus it will ultimately be the rider that determines who
wins.

I would expect that a uni.5 or coker would not be allowed since they
exceed the 28 gear inch (safety) limit.

Sincerely,

Ken Fuchs <kfuchs@winternet.com>

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

>> Currently, riders with long legs may have an
>> advantage, since their optimal crank length is legal,
>> while shorter rider’s optimal crank length is may not
>> be legal, because it may be less than 5" (127mm).

John Foss <john_foss@asinet.com> wrote:

>The rider-height argument has been brought up many times over the years.
>However I never see height classifications in regular athletics. Short
>runners compete with tall runners, even though they have a clear
>disadvantage. Therefore I don’t subscribe to the argument of rider size as a
>reason to use different crank lengths. We divide riders by sex and age
>(except for Experts/finalists), but I do not intend to divide us by size,
>weight or any other factors.

I was not suggesting two or more minimum crank competition
classifications or height classifications. I was just stating that
riders with long legs may have an advantage over those with shorter legs
because the current minimum crank length of 5" (127mm) is too long.

I was pointing out that optimal crank length varies with leg length. A
number of physiological studies of bicyclists have proven this point for
bicycling at least.

>On the other hand, if we’re introducing a new wheel size, it may be possible
>to change the minimum crank arm length to something that allows wider
>flexibility. In other words, if we set the minimum at 89mm (the shortest
>size non-youth crank I’m aware of in the unicycling world), I think nearly
>everybody will be happy. We will still have a limit, people will have
>relatively easy access to those real-short cranks, and they can race on
>unicycles that are really hard to stop if they want!

89mm is a more flexible minimum crank arm length and is probably short
enough to eliminate the bias against riders with shorter legs.

However, I’d prefer no limit on crank arm length. For example, anything
shorter than 89mm may not be optimal for anyone in the shorter races.
Cranks shorter than 89mm may be useful in the 1500m and marathons.
The Japanese may be able to provide good record data on shorter cranks
as they allow them in their National Competitions and other races in
Japan.

As a compromise, the crank arm length limit could be set smaller as
commercially produced cranks become shorter (.i.e. 76mm).

Sincerely,

Ken Fuchs <kfuchs@winternet.com>

Re: Anybody want unicycle racing to get faster and more interesting?

Hello,

I’m sorry too rate respons. and too short messege.

>Japan with how many Unicyclists Yuichiro? about 10 Milions?

Now, Japanease unicyclists about 15 milions. maybe more!

Becourse, all elmental school must be study unicycle.


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