Any Toyota Prius owners here?

Off-topic
1

I’ve been seriously considering buying a new Prius, which would replace my '03 Honda CRV. The “break even” point is estimated at about 3 years, which is pretty good. “Real world” mileage would be about 45-50 mpg, which means even though the tank caspacity is only 11 gallons, (3 less than my CRV) I would be getting at least 2.5 times the MPG of my CRV.

Only thing I need to consider is if there will be adequate room for my piano stuff. The prius liftback seems to have enough room for all my tools and stuff. Anybody here have a prius, and if so, are you happy with it? I also would get a tax credit if I buy one before the end of '08.

2

I’m not an owner, but I think they are very cool cars. More efficient than the larger hybrids (like a Camry), so they should put more of a dent in your need to feed the oil companies.

For space purposes, your best bet is to measure and make sure the important stuff will fit in there.

Also both Jacquie and I have Toyotas, and they’ve been great cars. Low maintenance and good resale value. My next car will probably not be as big as my current Siena. That car’s great when it needs to be loaded up, but it gets too much use with just me in it.

BTW, what does the size of the gas tank have to do with fuel economy? :sunglasses:

3

I don’t own one, but I drove one for a few days while in Portland, OR on a business trip. It seemed pretty nice, nicer than most rental cars I’ve driven. I would consider buying one if I needed a new vehicle. Personally, I think the price is still kind of high when you can a used economy car for much less. Green is the new marketing machine! :wink:

I do remember being bothered every time the engine shut down while I was idling at a traffic light though, since I’m used to driving a manual and being aware of when the engine stalls. But I guess you’d get used to it.

4

Just take all your piano stuff with you and load it up as part of a test drive. Take your coker along too.

The other advantage is you get to use the carpool lanes even by yourself.

5

Yea we have one! They are totally amazing!

6

The thing is, the Prius is a mid-size sedan. The cars you’re comparing it to are compact cars. If you compare it to other mid-size sedans, it fares much better. Considering that gas prices are not only unlikely to dip, but continue to get more expensive, the Prius is a better value proposition than it was when it was first introduced.

I’m also considering a Prius, although I’m interested in seeing what Honda is going to do in 2009. From what I hear, they’re planning a Prius-like car which is NOT a variant of an existing model.

7

PRIUS OUTDOES HUMMER IN ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE

The Toyota Prius, the flagship car for the environmentally conscious, is the source of some of the worst pollution in North America, and takes more combined energy to produce than a Hummer, says the Recorder.

Consider:

* The nickel contained in the Prius' battery is mined and smelted at a plant in Ontario that has caused so much environmental damage to the surrounding environment that NASA has used the 'dead zone' around the plant to test moon rovers.
* Dubbed the Superstack, the factory has spread sulfur dioxide across northern Ontario, becoming every environmentalist's nightmare.
* Acid rain around the area was so bad it destroyed all the plants and the soil slid down off the hillside, according to Canadian Greenpeace energy-coordinator David Martin.
* After leaving the plant, the nickel travels to Europe, China, Japan and United States, a hardly environmentally sound round the world trip for a single battery.

But that isn’t even the worst part, says the Record. According to a study by CNW Marketing, the total combined energy to produce a Prius (consisting of electrical, fuel, transportation, materials and hundreds of other factors over the expected lifetime), is greater than what it takes to produce a Hummer:

* The Prius costs an average of $3.25 per mile driven over a lifetime of 100,000 miles -- the expected lifespan of the Hybrid.
* The Hummer, on the other hand, costs a more fiscal $1.95 per mile to put on the road over an expected lifetime of 300,000 miles.
* That means the Hummer will last three times longer than a Prius and use almost 50 percent less combined energy doing it.


Source: Chris Demorro, “Prius Outdoes Hummer in Environmental Damage,” The Recorder, March 7, 2007.

8

Here’s what I found that refutes that claim: (It’s always best to do your own research, rather than believe everything you read on the extreme of either side. :slight_smile: )

The original article is an opinion piece (i.e., no fact-checking) for a college newspaper that publishes wild claims in a pathetic attempt to draw attention to itself. In February, The Recorder published “Rape only hurts if you fight it” and now in March, “Prius outdoes hummer.” This newspaper and this article are garbage.

  1. Regarding new EPA mileage estimates, Demorro claims the Chevy Aveo’s mileage puts it within “spitting distance” of the Prius. The new EPA combined mileage put the Chevy Aveo at 26 mpg, the Toyota Prius at 46 mpg. So I guess 20 miles more per gallon is “spitting distance.”

  2. The “Dust-to-dust” study is from a marketing firm, not a science journal. It arrives at an artificially high cost for the Prius by assigning it an arbitrary lifespan of 100k miles, and a Hummer 300k miles. There’s Prius being used as cabs that have 200k on them now:

And, insofar as a car lasting, what car do you expect to repair less? A Toyota Prius or a GM Hummer? You can check Consumer Reports for the answer to that one. A good analysis of the flaws in dust-to-dust is available

  1. The Sudbury info is seriously outdated, and the comment about moon buggies (like, when did Nasa test moon buggies — early 1970’s) ought to have given the author a clue. Sudbury was polluted by a century of mining (1870 on). In fact, some of Sudbury’s nickel went into making the Statue of Liberty. Currently, the mine is owned by INCO (not Toyota), and produces 100,000 tons of nickel a year, of which Toyota buys 1% (1000 tons). Blaming Toyota for the pollution at Sudbury is ludicrous. Nickel, by the way, is primarily used to make stainless steel. The Mail on Sunday newspaper, which ran the story the college article is a thin re-write of (visible here ), used a stock photo you can buy online taken in 1994 to illustrate the pollution (visible here ). There were, of course, no Prius in existence or being manufactured in 1994.

Furthermore, Sudbury is no longer this polluted, as INCO and the city have planted over 8 million trees there since 1979. The best history online of the Sudbury devastation/reforestation comes from GM Canada – that’s GM, maker of the Hummer, ahem, writing about how Sudbury was polluted and how it has come back. Really, one should blame Chicago more than Toyota, as Sudbury’s trees were all cut down in 1871 to help rebuild Chicago after the fire. GM provides telling photos of some of the reclamation from 1979 to present.

9

I remember reading that article. It’s pretty manufactured pro-SUV propaganda.

Ok, this sounds bad. Assumming its true, as a percentage of output, how much of the nickel is for Toyota? 1%? 100%? For all we know, this could be the main smelting plant for all nickel produced in N. America.

Really? 100k miles from a toyota? 100k miles is how long the batteries are under warranty, not the livetime of the vehicle. (or even necessarily the lifetime of the batteries). Anybody who’s ever owned a Toyota would have milk shoot out of their nose if they were told that 100k was the lifespan of their car. Even if they weren’t even drinking milk!! The Prius is turning out to be just as reliable as any other car they make.

300k from a Hummer? Are they just making stuff up?

What were the gas prices when they did their “math” Given how shady the rest of the information is, how can we trust when they say it takes TWICE as much energy to manufacture a Prius as a Hummer. It seems that would be reflected in the price, or that Toyota is selling the Prius at a loss (which they aren’t…anymore)

EDIT: MUNIAddict beat me to it, and he did more homework.

10

Here’s another article that debunks the bogus claims:

http://climateprogress.org/2007/08/27/prius-easily-beats-hummer-in-life-cycle-energy-use-dust-to-dust-report-has-no-basis-in-fact/

But hey, people are certainly free to believe what they want to believe. Again, do your own research and make your own decision based on facts, not fiction.

11

I have a prius and it is awesome. The prius has loads of space for your tools (and unicycles). :smiley: The fold down back seats come in handy for hauling lots of stuff. The only thing I don’t like about it is that it doesn’t have great clearance. (It bottoms out on our driveway when there’s more than 2 people in it.) But then again we have a crappy driveway:p I think you should buy it, you definitely won’t regret it.

12

Over priced, not very economical, poor performance and in my opinion not good looking. I drive a Toyota, but that cars just a toymota.

If your going to want to save the Tasmanian fruit bat, go for a diesel. My dad can get about 60 mpg on the motorway in a Passat TDi, this car apparently got only 45 mpg on a (different) motorway drive.

Go for a diesel, preferrably a TDi if you ever want it to move. Haven’t heard anything good about the Prius… Here is a Top Gear episode reveiw. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=LmG05AtNVtM

Cheers.

[EDIT]

You have a Prius? Did you pay for that or did daddy?

13

Over priced, not very economical, poor performance and in my opinion not good looking. I drive a Toyota, but that cars just a toymota.

If your going to want to save the Tasmanian fruit bat, go for a diesel. My dad can get about 60 mpg on the motorway in a Passat TDi, this car apparently got only 45 mpg on a (different) motorway drive.

Go for a diesel, preferrably a TDi if you ever want it to move. Haven’t heard anything good about the Prius… Here is a Top Gear episode reveiw. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=LmG05AtNVtM

Cheers.

14

I’m not claiming the validity of anything, I’m just injecting food for thought.

Here’s something else for you to chew on while digesting that last bit.

What about the Prius’s serviceability? You can take most anything with an internal combustion engine to most any neighborhood mechanic for service. Granted, with more and more electronics, some services (such as the “tune up”, which doesn’t involve much tuning anymore) are becoming more difficult to perform, but they’re still possible.

Now, with a Prius, how many shops can service that puppy? Are you at the mercy of the dealership now? Watch out, there… service rates (and parts) from dealers can be much more expensive than aftermarket and third-party shops. You can’t argue about that.

Furthermore, forget about most DIY maintenance.

This is my biggest beef about the Prius. While it’s a step towards better emissions and efficiency, it’s a leap away from self-reliance.

15

It’s actually my dad’s car but I’m learning how to drive in it.

16

Well in Oz we get these Hybrids…
1) Honda Civic.
2) Lexus RX400.
3) Lexus LS600h.
4) Toyota Prius.

and apparently we’re getting more from other manufacturers soon. :astonished:

17

I like to look at the all inclusive price of the vehicles to determine whether it’s environmentally friendly. I figure that if one is cheaper than the other when including the initial cost, the running cost and the recycling/full-disposal costs (absent any misleading subsidies), then it is environmentally more friendly. The cost of each of these are directly related to the resources used, and the ultimate resource in which all other resources can be renewed is energy, so the overall cost is directly proportional to the energy used over this vehicles life. A few years back when I was punching some numbers, the Prius was still not up there as being competitive with a similar sized non-hybrid Toyota, mostly due to the battery causing a higher initial cost and higher end of life cost to the car. I bet that will change as batteries become better and Toyota fine tunes things.

18

But my Toyota doesn’t break.

That said, when it does need work it’ll probably cost more.

Also you’d have to be pretty thick to swallow that original article that compares the Hummer to the Prius. Something like that would not have stayed an obscure news item were there any reality to it.