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Old 2017-01-10, 07:15 PM   #1
gregolopogus
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Best wheel size for Muni?

So I've been riding for over 10 years now and I like doing everything from street to trials to muni. I really enjoy trail riding and want to do it more as I live in an area with tons of beautiful trails, but I only have a KH20 which is perfect for trials and tricks but, as you may know, is not so great for muni (on account of it being soooo slow). I want to buy a unicycle with a larger wheel but I'm just not sure what size to get.

I thought I wanted a 26" but they seem a lot harder to find (I'm trying to buy second hand cause I'm on a university budget) and everyone seems to be selling their 24". (I actually found the perfect 26" once but it had already sold )

Anyway I was wondering if I should hold out for a 26" to come along or if I should just settle for a 24" if there isn't that much of a difference...
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Old 2017-01-10, 07:33 PM   #2
rrurban
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Opinions will vary but for me a 26" is the easiest to do sharp turns, avoid obstacles (or hop them) and to do inclines on. I've got 3 unicyles now and each has it's own purpose

26 Muni
27.5 Winter ride (spiked tires for ice/snow)
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Old 2017-01-10, 08:48 PM   #3
Bradford
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregolopogus View Post
So I've been riding for over 10 years now and I like doing everything from street to trials to muni. I really enjoy trail riding and want to do it more as I live in an area with tons of beautiful trails, but I only have a KH20 which is perfect for trials and tricks but, as you may know, is not so great for muni (on account of it being soooo slow). I want to buy a unicycle with a larger wheel but I'm just not sure what size to get.

I thought I wanted a 26" but they seem a lot harder to find (I'm trying to buy second hand cause I'm on a university budget) and everyone seems to be selling their 24". (I actually found the perfect 26" once but it had already sold )

Anyway I was wondering if I should hold out for a 26" to come along or if I should just settle for a 24" if there isn't that much of a difference...
It's not just a matter of speed, but also rolling resistance. Generally, the bigger the wheel, the less rolling resistance and the easier it is to just roll over stuff.

This topic has been discussed a lot. You might use the search function on the site to see previous posts about this.

Depending on what kind of off roading you want to do, there are different answers to your question. A 26" is probably the most popular and is a good size for all around muni stuff and a good place to start. It's also a popular size with both muni and mountain bikes, so there is a wide variety and availability of tires.
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Old 2017-01-10, 09:40 PM   #4
juggleaddict
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29. Duh :P

It depends, as always. Where do you ride? How strong of a rider are you? What lines do you like to take? Do you want to do drops? Tricks? How much distance do you want to cover? What length crank do you prefer?

Personally I think a 29 is easiest to ride, even over technical terrain because of the rollover. I've started taking to the 26 fatty as my primary because it's the same diameter (basically) as the 29, but tackles sand and snow on the trails I ride better. The cushy tire steamrolls over most obstacles too, so even though it's more to push, fatigue is reduced.

If you want to stay relatively slow, a 26 or 24 could both work. If you can only find a 24, but want to ride some XC, then put some 125s (138s work really great for more technical stuff) on it and go to town.

You'll get used to whatever setup you have. Get what you want and love it. As long as you're riding, you're probably having fun either way.

Anyway, my personal pick on a budget is the nimbus 29er muni. It's a really really good deal, and despite being half the price of the oracle, the steel frame is only marginally (<< 1lb) heavier than the aluminum oracle. No brake, but you really don't need one (I ride without) and could always find a rim brake later. If you could splurge a little, a KH fusion saddle and KH dual hole cranks really makes it one of the best deals out there. http://www.unicycle.com/nimbus-29-mo...unicycle-blue/
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Old 2017-01-10, 11:23 PM   #5
elpuebloUNIdo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradford View Post
It's not just a matter of speed, but also rolling resistance. Generally, the bigger the wheel, the less rolling resistance and the easier it is to just roll over stuff.
My understanding of rolling resistance has to do with the continuous cycles of deformation and recovery of the tire which create inefficiency. The "roll-over" of a large wheel vs. a small wheel, to my understanding, is something different.

A large wheel may be moving faster and be heavier, creating greater inertia to lift the wheel over an obstacle. Assuming there is no tire deformation, a large wheel lifts itself over an obstacle over a larger distance, compared to a smaller wheel.

If momentum is lost, a relatively small wheel with relatively long cranks would power over obstacles better than a large wheel. I think it's necessary to qualify the "roll-over" qualities of a setup with an indication of speed. So many "which setup is best" discussions are problematic because of differences in riding ability, trail conditions, what constitutes a "hill", etc.
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Old 2017-01-11, 04:36 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elpuebloUNIdo View Post
My understanding of rolling resistance has to do with the continuous cycles of deformation and recovery of the tire which create inefficiency. The "roll-over" of a large wheel vs. a small wheel, to my understanding, is something different.

A large wheel may be moving faster and be heavier, creating greater inertia to lift the wheel over an obstacle. Assuming there is no tire deformation, a large wheel lifts itself over an obstacle over a larger distance, compared to a smaller wheel.

If momentum is lost, a relatively small wheel with relatively long cranks would power over obstacles better than a large wheel. I think it's necessary to qualify the "roll-over" qualities of a setup with an indication of speed. So many "which setup is best" discussions are problematic because of differences in riding ability, trail conditions, what constitutes a "hill", etc.
I wasn't trying to be technical. I was trying to explain in my own words that big round things generally roll over stuff easier than small round things based on my personal experience. The person didn't give specifics, so I can only speak in generalities.
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Old 2017-01-11, 04:49 AM   #7
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These days, the 24" Muni size seems to suffer from a lot less choices of tire. They were very popular starting from the earliest days of Muni with fat tires, and I loved my Wilder with a 24x3 Gazzalodi tire (followed by others). But when I got my new one last summer, I avoided all the technical discussion and just got "what Kris rides". Of course Kris Holm rides all sorts of wheels, and is probably always testing the next thing. But when I've seen him at Muni Weekends, it's almost always on a 26" Muni with a brake, which is what I got!

He has a Schlumpf on his, which is a possible upgrade for me in the future...

I think it's the best machine for riding at decent speed on fairly technical terrain. If you like faster, flowy riding, go for a 29". If you can't make up your mind between those two, I'd say get the 27.5"
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Old 2017-01-11, 04:33 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnfoss View Post
These days, the 24" Muni size seems to suffer from a lot less choices of tire. They were very popular starting from the earliest days of Muni with fat tires, and I loved my Wilder with a 24x3 Gazzalodi tire (followed by others).
I love the idea of the larger cushion of a fatty, but a 26" ends up being 30" dia. This is too much for my property where I mostly ride a coupe hundred feet.
I see the only tire choice for muni 24 that is posted, only go to 3".
The mad4one website has a fatty that is 4" which is either Vee Mission Rubber rigid or CHAOYANG Big Daddy. These have a diameter of 26.75". This sounds like a great replacement for my cheap 24.
I am nervous that there aren't any reviews on these tires. since I read about all the tracking problems they can have.

Does anyone have any insight about how they might ride?
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Old 2017-01-11, 06:05 PM   #9
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The Vee Mission Rubber is about the worst tire I've ever ridden, road or mountain. Admittedly, I rode it on a fat bike, but the amount of auto-steer, straight-suck, whatever you want to call it, was atrocious even at moderate and high pressures. At low pressures it was nearly unrideable on the road. It was OK on dirt on a bike, but even my larry was much better grip wise and autosteer wise. The missions are made of really cheap rubber too and start disintegrating pretty fast. They may work for a 24 that you have a little more torque over depending on what crank size you run, but for a 26 fat, there are way too many options to justify it. If you had to go with it, I'd at least run it with the tred backwards, which seemed to help the larry out.
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Old 2017-01-12, 04:14 PM   #10
superfunk
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Specialized has a 24x4 with a nice thread pattern.
And the weight seems fair for its size
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Old 2017-01-12, 06:09 PM   #11
grizbach
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Thanks for the advice guys. I'm forming a 24 fatty plan.
If I can get a complete wheel setup, I should be able to make a frame to fit since it seems conundrums aren't available.
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Old 2017-01-13, 01:47 PM   #12
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spiker

Quote:
Originally Posted by rrurban View Post

27.5 Winter ride (spiked tires for ice/snow)
Did you spike the tire yourself and if so how? Strava pics stock tire...

I'm wishing I had a spiked fat uni w/ the snow and ice now on the FR. Like to find a cheap Surly and spike it myself... Throw the 170s on it and go everywhere...

I apologize for thread hijacking...

Thx

Last edited by Unitardis; 2017-01-13 at 01:49 PM.
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Old 2017-01-14, 09:33 PM   #13
Mikefule
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At small to medium wheel sizes, an inch or two makes more difference.

For example, a 24" uni is 4/20 (20%) bigger than a 20.

A 28" uni is only 4/24 (16.7%) bigger than a 24.

This means that, all other things being equal, a 24 will be 20% faster than a 20, and a 26 will be only 8% faster than a 24.

Assuming a riding speed around 8 mph/13 kmh, all other things being equal, a 26 will only go 2/3 mph hour faster than a 24 - which is negligible.

However, all other things aren't equal, because you need to consider the tyre section, the availability of tyres, your level of skill and confidence, and so on.

Also, because of the angles involved, a 26 will roll over things more easily than a 24.

Rather than going into the maths, think of these extreme examples:

A 2 inch wheel hits a 2 inch vertical step. It stops dead.

A 36 inch wheel hits a 2 inch vertical step: it barely notices.

Now apply this obvious principle to the 24 and 26 meeting a typical tree root. Whatever you decide to call it (angle of incidence? Angle of attack? Rollover factor?) the bigger wheel will always make less fuss about any given obstacle.

A fatter and softer tyre will also smooth out these small obstacles.

On the other hand, if you want to hop over an obstacle, the smaller and lighter the uni, the easier it is.

I ride and have ridden several unis off road on forest trails, rough tracks, uncultivated ground, and sometimes moorland. These include:

20 wth 125s
24 x 1.75 with 102mm cranks
26 with variosu cranks
28 x 23 with 114 mm cranks
29 with 150s and 125s
24 x 2.3 with 170s and with 150s
36 with 150s and with 125s

While you are just riding along the trail, there is no doubt that a 29 is easier than a 26 and a 26 is easier than a 24, as long as you are confident on that wheel size.

As soon as you need to stop, idle, reverse, turn suddenly, etc., the smaller size is easier.

End result: 3 recommendations:

If I could only afford one uni for general purpose including light off road, trails and the like, it would be a 29.

If I was never going to ride it on tarmac, but only on rough ground and trails, I'd probably go for the 26.

If I was going to ride the toughest stuff I could manage, and take risks, I'd go for a fat tyred 24.
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Old 2017-02-26, 12:58 PM   #14
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Well, after a lot of reading and dreaming, I finally made a decision and purchased a KH 24 inch muni with 125/150 cranks. Yesterday was its madien voyage and I could not be happier. I rode for about 2 hours through a local mountain bike trail and although it’s noticabily slower than my 29 inch Nimbus muni at the same 150 crank length, I enjoyed its pivoting quickness and its brute force in climbing short steep hills. I even handled my first ‘unplanned' 5 inch drop without a UPD.

As stated by many on this forum, selecting a unicycle “depends” on a lot of variables [juggleaddict]. It depends on where you ride, skills of riding, experience with riding other unicycles, what you want to learn to do and how much cash is in your pocket.

I love rough terrain riding. Cross-country and mountain bike paths are my current fascinations and slow to moderate speeds are good for me.

Since I did not have an opportunity to try out other sizes before making this purchase, I based my decision to buy the 24 inch KH on the following:
  • 26 inch would be too close to the ride of my 29 inch muni
  • a 26 inch would still be too high for me to practice new skills (At times, it can still be scary up there.)
  • traveling with a 24 inch in a suitcase or in the back of my care would would be easier
  • I’m not worried about having an external disc, because if I’d ever damaged the external disc, I will hang it on my wall with pride for riding so aggressive that I could do something like that
  • My history was similar to uniscott’s story (thanks for a sharing)
  • Schumpf insight from saskatchewanian
  • The Nimbus with the cranks and seat I wanted put it in the same price category as the KH
  • my local mountain bike trails offer technical tracks and cross-country tracks.
If I was only going to own one muni, it would be a 26 inch.
If I was only going to own two mountain unicycles, it would be a 24 inch and a 29 inch (maybe with a schlumpf)
If I was only going to own three unicycles, it would be a 24, 29 and a road 36 inch (it looks like I’m headed in this direction).

And to all for posted there stories and advice throughout this forum, I say, "Thank you." I could not have made my decision without your input.

Hey, George J, machineman and gregolopogus,

How is your selection process going?

New uni suggestions: thread started by machineman

Some Muni Questions: thread started by George J
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Old 2017-02-26, 11:59 PM   #15
George J
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Unisphere, I ended up getting a KH 27.5. I haven't ridden it very much since I broke my finger and I've been really busy with college lately, but I think it was a good choice.
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