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Old 2018-06-17, 03:20 PM   #76
JimT
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....3. Sitting on perineum: Biggest roadblock for at the moment. I want my sit bone to be directly above the seat post. That requires the widest part of the saddle—the rear of the saddle—to be positioned also directly above the wheel axle. Unfortunately, my saddle is already is adjusted as far forward as it can go and it's still inadequate. Currently the only way round this is for me to lean further forward, which brings the back of the saddle to where it should be (good) but the back of the saddle ends up sloping downwards and forward. As a result, I tend to slide forward into the saddle, further sliding prevented by my perineum hitting the upslope of the saddle. Sitting on the perineum is incorrect and very uncomfortable. Eventually I just end up semi-sitting and semi-standing, which is very inefficient. I am convinced this is a seat ergonomics problem. I know KH does a flatter saddle, that seems like it might do the trick. I would love some advice on this as it's preventing me from enjoying my rides.

I'll post some pics of my machine later
It is not really the forward and back position of the saddle that will determine where most of your weight is. The angle of the saddle will determine this with the nose of the saddle higher and the rear lower then rider will tend to stay back on the wider part of the saddle. Shims can be added in the front to raise the front more and the shape of the saddle comes it to play also. If the saddle has too much curve then very sensitive body parts may start to get in the way before the rear part of the saddle is at the lowest part. Just try different angles to see what happens.

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Old 2018-06-17, 03:34 PM   #77
elpuebloUNIdo
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Scoox, congratulations on your super-human progress! OMG, it took me several weeks to progress to the point you are already! I suppose the trials bicycle background helped?

Your issues with the seat sound pretty typical. I suggest you try solving the problem with bike shorts before moving onto a newer saddle. Since you're such a fast learner, it may not be long before you learn to ride with one hand on the saddle, and you'll be able to orient your sit bones and your junk better when that happens. Of the three saddles you mentioned, I only have experience with the Stadium saddle. It's not really designed for holding onto the seat in a variety of ways, so it might not be the best for general purpose learning on the 20", but it has been great for longer distance. We are all so different, and the right saddle is a matter of personal taste.
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Old 2018-06-17, 07:34 PM   #78
song
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Originally Posted by Scoox View Post
I think cycling shorts might help with inner thigh chafing though but not so much with diamond-related issues. My current goal is to replace my commuter folding bike with a unicycle. Uni trials is a possibility but I first want to focus on general riding so I need a saddle that will enable me to ride, say, up to 10 miles fairly comfortably. Just now I came back from my longest ride thus far, I was able to go about a mile down a trail without any UPDs and had to dismount only because the trail was narrow and there was a big SUV driving towards me. Pressure on perineum still a problem, the diamonds problem only happens when mounting and is partially solved by initially sitting slightly forward and then sliding back to ensure things end up in the right place... if that makes sense.
If you're thinking of going on 10-mile rides, you really need a larger wheel than the one you bought last month. I have taken 5-mile trips on a 20, and it was OK, but it is not something I would do regularly. There are millions of threads here about 29 versus 36 and so on.

I have only really had inner thigh chafing problems when riding on the horrendously bad seat that came with my cheap first unicycle, but yeah, maybe you can solve your current problem with biker shorts, I don't know. Before you spend lots of money on biker shorts or a new seat and seatpost, and before you spend time carving up and boiling your seat, try following the advice posted just above by JimT and elpuebloUNIdo. When it comes to unicycling, problems with your balls are often just from sitting in the wrong position, while chafing on your inner thighs is usually due to some fundamental structural flaw in the seat. General numbness in your entire crotch during long rides is pretty much inevitable, but very easy to get rid of just by either rising up off the seat for a while or taking a break for one or two minutes. Some people also resort to installing handlebars on their large-wheeled unicycles, but again, that's a topic that I'll leave to someone else.
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Old 2018-06-17, 10:14 PM   #79
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All has been said...
But in the beginning, chafing is made worse because one tends to "squeeze" the saddle between your legs out of tension. And also because the skin there is thin and hasn't been attacked ever.
Though on long rides, shorts and chamois cream do help for sure.

To get the family jewels out of reach, you can go for a full cycling bib, that will hold everybody up. Or get a pair of Aussiebum underpants, their EnlargeIt series was suggested here as an interesting special pouch bring the family kit further front. Just be warned it's a very popular brand in the gay community, so be ready for an upfront website.

Commuting 10 miles on a uni... why not, but rethink the wheel size, and make sure there are showers on arrival.
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Old 2018-06-18, 05:39 AM   #80
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All replies noted and appreciated I didn't think about using shims there, probably because my saddle is held in place by closed end nuts, not bolts. But reckon I can squeeze at least a couple of them in there to see if there's some improvement, and then go from there.

Might grab a pair of cycling pants. I've just looked at the gay pants, they might work, might grab a pair just to check them out. They are a little expensive for a pair of pants though.

The problem with cycling shorts, IMO, is that you can't just grab your uni and go, you have to first change into "uni clothes", which kinda kills the whole simplicity vibe. I'm a briefs kinda guy but switching to some kind of tight-fitting boxers might help at least with the inner thigh chafing—maybe? I am convinced that saddle ergonomics can take care of most problems.

The other option would be to make a saddle by Frankensteining my existing saddle bumpers onto a CNCed piece of carbon fibre board, a matching piece of CNCed EVA foam to go on top and around, and then finish it all off with a layer of soft foam plus a saddle cover from UDC. I can order the CNC bits, I just need to design the parts in Fusion 360 and send the CAD files off. Of course the saddle base would be flat but I could design it in such a way that tilt and backward-forward position could be adjusted. In addition, EVA foam can be 3D machined to give it a bit of a contour like regular saddles, plus a groove down the middle for the jewels. It can even have holes to allow it to breathe.

Quick question about larger wheel size, UDC China have the KH 26" on sale (from 4970 to 3970 CNY), maybe because it's a discontinued model. Would this be a good choice or is 27.5 inch a more versatile size? Maybe 26 inch was discontinued for a reason. Just been reading up on this and it seems 27.5 inch is now quite a common size for MTB, so tyre choice should not be a problem. If 27.5 inch is better then I'll pass up on this offer.

My intended use is metropolitan commutes in a medium-busy city where traffic rules are often ignored (China) and pretty much anything can happen on pavements (street sellers, middle-aged women dancing in the evening, parked cars, etc). That means there will be a fair bit of mount-and-dismount, obstacle avoidance, slow riding & idling, and at the same time there are dedicated bike lanes where one can enjoy a bit of speed for short periods of time.
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Old 2018-06-18, 09:03 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by Scoox View Post

Quick question about larger wheel size, UDC China have the KH 26" on sale (from 4970 to 3970 CNY), maybe because it's a discontinued model. Would this be a good choice or is 27.5 inch a more versatile size? Maybe 26 inch was discontinued for a reason. Just been reading up on this and it seems 27.5 inch is now quite a common size for MTB, so tyre choice should not be a problem. If 27.5 inch is better then I'll pass up on this offer.
The question on wheel size you already answered by yourself. Reason is the MTB standard with it high No. of different 27,5 plus tires. So KH and Quax discontinued 26 inch. Nimbus and m4o still offer 26. There is nothing wrong with this size, plenty of std size tires and even plus size tires are increasing. If you are purely into commuting a longer distance in a crowded city, I would probably go for a 29. However if its mainly Muni, why not the 26 if the deal is good.

As for the saddles: I can not comment on the KH one. However use the Nimbus stadium on my Muni and 36. It has low curve and is quite firm. I use it with the nose raised up and sit with my sitbones on the flat back part. That works fine for my ar... I also use the Nimbus flat (the new one with the same base as the Stadium) on my freestyle uni. That saddle is even harder than the Stadium and I would not use it for distance or Muni. But again, this is just my backside

As others commented: First try to optimize saddle position with the saddle you have, before spending money on a new one.
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Old 2018-06-18, 09:33 AM   #82
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As others commented: First try to optimize saddle position with the saddle you have, before spending money on a new one.
Best idea: don't overspend (time and money) at the moment. Just ride and get to know the uni better, to know how you deal with it and how you progress. It's too easy to get distracted into making/buying different equipment where the only thing that matters is practice practice practice.

Agree with kunstrasen, for what you describe, a 29" with a 3.0" tire (Surly Knard or alike) and not too short cranks (137mm) would be best for that kind of commute/city muni.
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Old 2018-06-18, 02:48 PM   #83
elpuebloUNIdo
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Originally Posted by Scoox View Post
The problem with cycling shorts, IMO, is that you can't just grab your uni and go, you have to first change into "uni clothes", which kinda kills the whole simplicity vibe.
You may need to wear cycling shorts for a while. Also, it's typical for novice riders to expend a lot of energy while riding. You might be sweating after your commute. But, as you learn to adjust yourself on the seat (+1 for bar ends) and become more efficient, I imagine you'll achieve your simplicity vibe.

Now that you can ride a mile without dismount, maybe you can temporarily stop focusing on distance, take shorter rides with controlled mounts and dismounts, practice skills. Just to let the chafing heal a little bit...

If you modify your seat, send us pictures.
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Old 2018-06-18, 07:17 PM   #84
song
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26” is good because there is a huge selection of tires, but I agree with the others who have recommended a 29” wheel for the commute that Scoox describes.

I have never owned biker shorts, and have only gotten chafing on my inner thighs when I had an absolutely horrific Savage seat with metal bumpers on it that were scratched and bent outwards from falls on concrete, though actually the vinyl parts of that seat often inflicted more pain than the scratched metal. The seats on both my current unis, as I mentioned, are some sort of KH/Nimbus thing from about 4-5 years ago, and they are good, but I just wanted to add here that even my cheap starter uni was comfortable enough once I put a Viscount seat on it. I don’t know if this brand is available anymore, and it was just a simple seat, not much good for hopping because of the tiny saddle horn, but more than once I used it to go for rides of several miles on a 20” wheel, and I never had any chafing problems.

My point is just that a state-of-the-art saddle is not necessarily the only thing that will work. Some saddles are totally unacceptable and should not be used at all, but beyond that, there is a pretty big variety that are OK. I sometimes go for rides of several miles on a Schwinn 24. It’s slightly less comfortable than my Nimbus/KH seats, and doesn’t feel as sturdy when I hop, but it is 100% ridable.
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Old 2018-06-18, 07:23 PM   #85
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Just want to add weight to the suggestion of a 29” wheel. Less tiring, faster and still very maneuverable. Personally I won't go with something smaller for what you aim to use it for.

I'd also go with cranks that are on the shorter side. Easier to maintain a high cadence. I have 125mm on mine and feel that I still have good control and can get up steep hills when I need to. 137mm might work better for you though, if there are lots of people/obstacles, as you would have more control.

Last edited by ruari; 2018-06-18 at 07:31 PM. Reason: Added more about cranks
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Old 2018-06-18, 08:46 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by Scoox View Post
The other option would be to make a saddle by Frankensteining my existing saddle bumpers onto a CNCed piece of carbon fibre board, a matching piece of CNCed EVA foam to go on top and around, and then finish it all off with a layer of soft foam plus a saddle cover from UDC. I can order the CNC bits, I just need to design the parts in Fusion 360 and send the CAD files off. Of course the saddle base would be flat but I could design it in such a way that tilt and backward-forward position could be adjusted. In addition, EVA foam can be 3D machined to give it a bit of a contour like regular saddles, plus a groove down the middle for the jewels.
It's way more easy than that! Remove staples, remove cover, remove foam (it could be glued or sort of, but use a knife and there won't be any problem that a cover wouldn't hide when you'll glue it again), boil the base, mould it the way you want, put a carboard on the foam and cut the same shape, take a foam that you like (was difficult to cut a kh and obtain a perfect work!) that is firm and easy to mod and cut the shape you desire (add a deep cutaway!). Than glue or used double sided sticky tape to fix the foam on the base. Apply cover. Apply staples stretching the cover a bit. It's more difficult to write than to do. You just need to try to understand how it is easy!
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Old 2018-06-20, 03:36 AM   #87
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Hey guys, thanks for all the great advice, I really appreciate it.

Two days ago I tried adding 2mm worth of shims to bring the front of the saddle up and the rear down a bit. I'm not sure whether this has helped, because it has resulted in the front coming up and back a bit (simple geometry), which means it's now a little closer to the jewels, and since there's still a bit of sliding forward, it hasn't really helped. However, this has revealed a couple of things:

1. I think the problem is not the angle so much as the saddle curvature. A flatter saddle is naturally roomier regardless of tilt. A perfectly flat saddle would provide infinite room. Boiling the saddle is the next thing I might try.

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2. I've ordered a pair of cycling shorts which should arrive today. I realised some of the discomfort was caused by the skin not gliding smoothly over the saddle, which is one of the problems cycling shorts are supposed to solve. It's not so much the padding in the shorts that helps, but the low friction. When wearing regular cotton shorts, which can get very moist, the skin is unable to move freely relative to the saddle, which results in chafing. Will report later.

Unfortunately it'll be raining cats and dogs till tomorrow so I will only be able to test in the corridor.

PS: I also tried making a kind of like a wedge out of a piece of EVA foam, which I sanded down to fit my saddle, but it's too dense and didn't really help at all.

Last edited by Scoox; 2018-06-20 at 03:39 AM.
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Old 2018-06-20, 02:28 PM   #88
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If your goal is trips of up to 10 miles, doing that on a 20” will be uncomfortable no matter what you do with the seat! You already ride well enough that if you had a 29” unicycle, you could start using it for those trips right now, and chances are it would come with a comfortable seat. The Nimbus 29" road unicycle seems to be sort of the standard road uni these days. The only thing I don’t like about mine is that the fork has a rounded crown, but that's only a problem because of my interest in one-footed and gliding skills. For regular riding on city streets, the Nimbus 29 is perfect. I have used it for many 20-mile trips in cotton shorts and didn't have any problem with chafing.

Just something to keep in mind if you get tired of tinkering with seat foam and have the money and the space for another unicycle. No matter what, though, it’s good to have a decent 20” for learning new skills, so you will probably want to fix or replace that seat. I actually ride my 20" more often than my 29" because it is more interesting, and also because commuting by unicycle has not been an option for me thus far, due to various combinations of distance, traffic conditions, logistics and concerns about what the bosses might do if they found out.
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Old 2018-06-20, 02:52 PM   #89
elpuebloUNIdo
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I think the problem is not the angle so much as the saddle curvature.
A long time ago, unicycles didn't have grab handles. The purpose of the seat was to maintain a good connection with the rider, and the designers accomplished that by making the saddle really curvy. Now that riding styles have changed, the saddle designers are slowly catching up. I think the saddles for sale nowadays are, on average, less scooped than the ones sold in the past. My Nimbus Equinox is 4 years old. It came with a Nimbus "Street" saddle, which I don't think is even sold any more. It is much more scooped than any of my other saddles. Anyhow, I recently changed the saddle to an Impact Naomi, which has a flatter profile.

I am not sure why Nimbus named its Stadium saddle thusly, but I think it's because it rises around the side and back edges (like a stadium), and it is recessed (or it has softer, more compliant material) in the center. I have been pretty comfortable going on long rides with the Stadium. I think my weight is mostly distributed across a horseshoe shaped area around the back rim of the Stadium. This spreads out the distribution of weight, while still using a relatively small amount of surface area. And because the rim of the Stadium is raised, there's less smashing of the stuff in the middle (refer to the frowning cartoon images in your last post). If I had to redesign the stadium, I'd exaggerate its chacteristics, by raising/hardening/fortifying the outer rim ... and making the center even more recessed/softer.

I've seen some interesting threads about saddle mods. If you haven't done so already, definitely search for them. Good luck!
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Old 2018-06-20, 05:53 PM   #90
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......I am not sure why Nimbus named its Stadium saddle thusly, but I think it's because it rises around the side and back edges (like a stadium), and it is recessed (or it has softer, more compliant material) in the center. I have been pretty comfortable going on long rides with the Stadium. I think my weight is mostly distributed across a horseshoe shaped area around the back rim of the Stadium. This spreads out the distribution of weight, while still using a relatively small amount of surface area. And because the rim of the Stadium is raised, there's less smashing of the stuff in the middle (refer to the frowning cartoon images in your last post). If I had to redesign the stadium, I'd exaggerate its chacteristics, by raising/hardening/fortifying the outer rim ... and making the center even more recessed/softer.

I've seen some interesting threads about saddle mods. If you haven't done so already, definitely search for them. Good luck!
The Stadium saddle is named that because it has a stadium shaped cutout in the middle. A stadium is a two-dimensional geometric shape constructed of a rectangle with semicircles at a pair of opposite sides. Alternative names include discorectangle and obround.

The Stadium saddle seems kind of square to me. I would like to see saddles made that were easier for owners to modify themselves. They can be opened up but staples and a glued on covers are a pain. It is clear that one size does not fit all riders and many could use a little tweaking to make the best fit.
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